WEBVTT 00:00:01.100 --> 00:00:07.970 Hi this is Ryan from ITS and the accessibility liaison for ITS 00:00:07.970 --> 00:00:13.320 today we have a Ken Nakata and Jeffrey Singleton from Cyxtera here to talk a 00:00:13.320 --> 00:00:16.680 little bit about web accessibility and accessibility law I just want to 00:00:16.680 --> 00:00:23.010 apologize for the time discrepancy we had we're supposed to start at 9:30 I 00:00:23.010 --> 00:00:26.250 just want to remind you guys to please hold all questions until after the 00:00:26.250 --> 00:00:30.900 presentation and thank you okay well thanks Ryan yeah it's a pleasure to be 00:00:30.900 --> 00:00:34.800 here my name is Ken Nakata and I gonna talk 00:00:34.800 --> 00:00:38.309 and my colleague Jeff singleton and I are going to be giving three 00:00:38.309 --> 00:00:44.579 presentations today and the first one is a legal presentation the second one is 00:00:44.579 --> 00:00:50.520 more of a overview of web access web content accessibility guidelines and and 00:00:50.520 --> 00:00:56.460 why they make sense and in the third presentation is really focused in on how 00:00:56.460 --> 00:01:02.359 do you how do you address this monster of dealing with web accessibility and 00:01:02.359 --> 00:01:07.439 what do you do about it when you’ve got things like content that's always changing so 00:01:07.439 --> 00:01:12.360 by back oh I should also mention that usually these presentations take about 00:01:12.360 --> 00:01:17.340 an hour we've got I figured we roughly have about half an hour to do the 00:01:17.340 --> 00:01:21.540 presentation and if we wanted to include questions and answers so they're gonna 00:01:21.540 --> 00:01:24.810 go pretty quickly this presentation the legal update 00:01:24.810 --> 00:01:30.840 I was really crunched to do it in an hour but I will but a large portion of 00:01:30.840 --> 00:01:35.640 it deals in private sector and I'm it's a very interesting topic it’s where all 00:01:35.640 --> 00:01:38.869 the action is right now and I'm going to try and go through that fairly quickly 00:01:38.869 --> 00:01:46.350 so because it's long and complicated and you're a title two entity now the title 00:01:46.350 --> 00:01:54.689 three entity so let's see the slides go back okay so my background my name is 00:01:54.689 --> 00:01:58.229 Ken Nakata I'm the director of the accessibility consulting practice at 00:01:58.229 --> 00:02:02.820 but really the thing that people know me for is I was I spent 12 00:02:02.820 --> 00:02:06.390 years at the Justice Department as one of the senior trial attorneys in the 00:02:06.390 --> 00:02:12.720 disability rights section working on originally traditional ADA cases in 00:02:12.720 --> 00:02:16.890 built environment title to title three cases and then 00:02:16.890 --> 00:02:21.810 after about six years of doing that then I transitioned over to helping with the 00:02:21.810 --> 00:02:25.860 rulemaking on section 508 of the Rehabilitation Act which focuses in on 00:02:25.860 --> 00:02:31.920 IT accessibility and I think it's the reason why is because I was the person at 00:02:31.920 --> 00:02:35.400 all and in the office who carried around a Palm Pilot that was back in 00:02:35.400 --> 00:02:41.190 those days the early days and most of the other attorneys just didn't want to 00:02:41.190 --> 00:02:45.720 have anything to do with technology so it was more a matter of shoveling off to 00:02:45.720 --> 00:02:49.530 somebody as opposed to oh my gosh I really have to do this but anyways it's 00:02:49.530 --> 00:02:54.150 been a it's been a great trip and I did that for about six years before leaving 00:02:54.150 --> 00:02:56.600 the Justice Department now I live in Seattle 00:02:56.600 --> 00:03:04.230 anyways so of course web accessibility is important it's important for 00:03:04.230 --> 00:03:08.340 everything that we do in society nowadays like applying for benefits or 00:03:08.340 --> 00:03:14.100 if you try to go to amazon.com which I seem to be on every day online shopping 00:03:14.100 --> 00:03:18.239 and obviously it's important for participation and organizations and in 00:03:18.239 --> 00:03:25.019 society it's important for in in the academic setting now especially with 00:03:25.019 --> 00:03:28.590 distance learning but even not just so for distance learning is so important 00:03:28.590 --> 00:03:31.680 for registering for classes and downloading assignments and all those 00:03:31.680 --> 00:03:35.850 sorts of good things one of the things that we've seen though is that 00:03:35.850 --> 00:03:40.920 originally the web accessibility cases weren't really all that terribly 00:03:40.920 --> 00:03:45.209 successful quite honestly and they've gotten a lot more successful recently 00:03:45.209 --> 00:03:49.350 and I think that the real reason for that is because the Internet's matured 00:03:49.350 --> 00:03:54.989 and in that time originally the sites were just informational sites and now 00:03:54.989 --> 00:03:58.500 the sites are becoming much more integrated with the things that are 00:03:58.500 --> 00:04:02.760 happening at a at a store so when we think about like what goes on with 00:04:02.760 --> 00:04:06.750 online shopping the fact that you can make returns or you can get coupons and 00:04:06.750 --> 00:04:11.430 things like that at a online for use at a physical store 00:04:11.430 --> 00:04:15.870 creates this connection between the two and there's been a lot easier to 00:04:15.870 --> 00:04:21.120 establish liability we've also seen whoops went the wrong way we've also 00:04:21.120 --> 00:04:25.530 seen this explosion in ADA cases this is this graph which is put 00:04:25.530 --> 00:04:30.360 together by my friend [indiscernible audio] shows this 00:04:30.360 --> 00:04:35.819 increase overall in the number of ADA cases over the last five or six years it 00:04:35.819 --> 00:04:39.690 was only twenty seven hundred twenty seven hundred and twenty two back in 00:04:39.690 --> 00:04:46.259 2013 last year was seven thousand eight hundred seven thousand six hundred and 00:04:46.259 --> 00:04:51.470 sixty three cases of those eight hundred thirteen were web accessibility cases in 00:04:51.470 --> 00:05:00.479 2017 but the number of web accessibility cases in particular is is exploding 00:05:00.479 --> 00:05:06.719 right now um so this graph serves the number of web accessibility cases that 00:05:06.719 --> 00:05:13.500 have how the number has increased over the last over the years and 2018 is set 00:05:13.500 --> 00:05:20.250 to be well a big year it's going to be probably 50% larger than 2017 one of the 00:05:20.250 --> 00:05:24.030 interesting phenomenons they noticed is that when we actually break down the 00:05:24.030 --> 00:05:27.569 cases New York's New York in particular the 00:05:27.569 --> 00:05:32.909 Southern District of New York which is basically lower Manhattan and I'm sorry 00:05:32.909 --> 00:05:37.229 in lower New York City the lower portion of New York State that includes New York 00:05:37.229 --> 00:05:42.840 City but not Brooklyn and and certain counties in that southern area 00:05:42.840 --> 00:05:48.389 comprise the Southern District of New York and that jurisdiction in particular 00:05:48.389 --> 00:05:53.250 has just exploded now even though the lawsuits are brought there that doesn't 00:05:53.250 --> 00:05:56.279 necessarily mean that the defendants live there that's just where the 00:05:56.279 --> 00:06:02.789 plaintiffs are filing their lawsuits so so looking at the totals from September 00:06:02.789 --> 00:06:09.389 through the beginning of the year 793 were in basically Manhattan and in only 00:06:09.389 --> 00:06:14.669 a hundred fifty were outside of that for all the web accessibility cases and 150 00:06:14.669 --> 00:06:22.349 cases are progressive nation so let's see let's talk about the law private 00:06:22.349 --> 00:06:27.029 sector is that where all the action seems to be happening right now I'm 00:06:27.029 --> 00:06:31.289 going to talk about the law and private sector and public sector and the public 00:06:31.289 --> 00:06:34.860 sector is going to be really quick and because it's a very simple topic and 00:06:34.860 --> 00:06:38.070 then we're going to get into the defenses which I think is the defenses 00:06:38.070 --> 00:06:42.210 are applicable to every organization doesn't matter whether your 00:06:42.210 --> 00:06:46.020 private sector or public sector it's under title three we've got this 00:06:46.020 --> 00:06:51.919 language that this is for private businesses in order to be liable under 00:06:51.919 --> 00:06:56.940 under title 3 of the ADA a you have to fall under one of 12 categories of what 00:06:56.940 --> 00:07:00.110 we call place of public accommodation and they're very broadly defined 00:07:00.110 --> 00:07:05.449 categories like a retail establishment or a social service establishment or 00:07:05.449 --> 00:07:09.630 things like place that entertainment for an instance and as long as you fall 00:07:09.630 --> 00:07:13.550 within one of those 12 types of businesses you're covered by the ADA 00:07:13.550 --> 00:07:18.810 but the language the general non-discrimination language I'll read 00:07:18.810 --> 00:07:22.349 this paragraph to you it's no individual shall be discriminated against on the 00:07:22.349 --> 00:07:25.680 basis of disability and the full and equal enjoyment of the goods services 00:07:25.680 --> 00:07:30.330 facilities privileges advantages or accommodations of any place of public 00:07:30.330 --> 00:07:35.699 accommodation and lawyers love to you know argue how many angels can dance on 00:07:35.699 --> 00:07:42.300 the head of a pin and so they they focused in on that word place and so the 00:07:42.300 --> 00:07:45.840 question became where is this place that we're talking about when we're dealing 00:07:45.840 --> 00:07:52.159 with the internet and has created a big split in the circuits now a lot of this 00:07:52.159 --> 00:07:57.479 this issue about place isn't unique to just web accessibility 00:07:57.479 --> 00:08:01.380 it also comes up in insurance cases and so a lot of the case law originally 00:08:01.380 --> 00:08:05.940 developed in insurance cases because in insurance cases sometimes you get a 00:08:05.940 --> 00:08:09.330 policy but you're not actually going into a physical office to get the policy 00:08:09.330 --> 00:08:15.449 and so the early cases all came out of insurance cases another important caveat 00:08:15.449 --> 00:08:19.830 to know in all of this is that much of the case law comes up in a motion to 00:08:19.830 --> 00:08:24.150 dismiss so for the folks that are in the room that aren't lawyers what that means 00:08:24.150 --> 00:08:29.849 is that when you file a complaint and the defendant will come back to you 00:08:29.849 --> 00:08:34.050 after they well sometimes before they answer sometimes after they give you 00:08:34.050 --> 00:08:37.289 their answer and they make a motion to dismiss and what they're basically doing 00:08:37.289 --> 00:08:41.729 is they're saying well you know the plaintiffs case isn't read brought in 00:08:41.729 --> 00:08:48.600 the right court we should kick it out or the case isn't being the case involves a 00:08:48.600 --> 00:08:53.550 plaintiff who doesn't didn't really suffer any injury so we have to you know he's 00:08:53.550 --> 00:08:57.150 got nothing complain about so kick the case out no 00:08:57.150 --> 00:09:00.810 evidence has been presented yet it's all based upon what the plaintiffs 00:09:00.810 --> 00:09:04.500 allegations are and whether they're even sufficient to bring a lawsuit that's 00:09:04.500 --> 00:09:07.440 what happens at a motion that's what happens that I'm when a defendant makes 00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:12.060 a motion to dismiss it has to be done very early in the lawsuit so a lot of 00:09:12.060 --> 00:09:16.830 these cases that we see reported are in that motion to dismiss stage and that's 00:09:16.830 --> 00:09:20.520 very important because that you have to take it with a grain of salt because the 00:09:20.520 --> 00:09:27.260 court is interpreting all the facts in favor of the plaintiff at that stage so 00:09:27.260 --> 00:09:30.960 there are a couple exceptions to that Gil versus Winn-Dixie out of the 00:09:30.960 --> 00:09:34.470 Southern District of Florida was a case that actually went all the way through 00:09:34.470 --> 00:09:40.170 trial the court finally said yeah Mr. Gill you win Winn-Dixie you lose it's 00:09:40.170 --> 00:09:45.510 currently on appeal another one is Davis versus BMI travel where which is a 00:09:45.510 --> 00:09:51.120 California Superior Court case that one I was decided on a motion to dismiss in 00:09:51.120 --> 00:09:55.950 favor of the not a motion to dismiss a I'm sorry motion for summary judgment in 00:09:55.950 --> 00:10:02.130 favor of plaintiff that's later in the litigation this is where defense went on 00:10:02.130 --> 00:10:07.800 a motion for summary judgment the you've gone through all the discovery all the 00:10:07.800 --> 00:10:10.860 facts are now presented and now you would make the argument to the court 00:10:10.860 --> 00:10:16.740 saying look on the basis of all of these facts I should win there's no sense in 00:10:16.740 --> 00:10:22.050 going even going to trial and so in that case in Davis versus BMI plaintiff 00:10:22.050 --> 00:10:27.060 actually won there was so much evidence and in his favor that the court just 00:10:27.060 --> 00:10:31.920 decided that he should win okay so I said there's a split in the circuits the 00:10:31.920 --> 00:10:37.050 First and Seventh Circuit go in favor interpret this place language extremely 00:10:37.050 --> 00:10:42.510 broadly and the most famous case is the car parts distribution case it's from 00:10:42.510 --> 00:10:49.320 1994 it's a really often cited opinion and it's an insurance case and basically 00:10:49.320 --> 00:10:54.720 it's it it's in one of those cases where the court laid down this idea that it 00:10:54.720 --> 00:11:00.510 you don't really need a physical place in order to be held liable as followed 00:11:00.510 --> 00:11:05.610 by Doe versus Mutual of Omaha and the Seventh Circuit but when we look at the 00:11:05.610 --> 00:11:10.300 internet cases they've also been taking this concept 00:11:10.320 --> 00:11:15.120 and interpreting it very broadly so a really interesting case and the reason 00:11:15.120 --> 00:11:19.470 why it's interesting is because of a later slide I'll discuss National 00:11:19.470 --> 00:11:24.029 Association of the Deaf versus Netflix was a lawsuit brought against Netflix or 00:11:24.029 --> 00:11:28.889 lack of closed captioning in their videos this was a case where defendant 00:11:28.889 --> 00:11:35.389 made a motion to dismiss there's an opinion at that site 869 F supp 2nd 169 00:11:35.389 --> 00:11:39.779 where the court said no you don't get defendant you don't get to win on your 00:11:39.779 --> 00:11:45.149 motion to dismiss and reason is is because even though Netflix doesn't have 00:11:45.149 --> 00:11:49.649 a store doesn't have a physical location they still were able to say look you're 00:11:49.649 --> 00:11:54.480 still a place of entertainment and so you're a place you're you fall within 00:11:54.480 --> 00:11:58.889 one of the 12 categories so we can hold we can we can proceed to trial and the 00:11:58.889 --> 00:12:03.180 plaintiff could proceed there's a different approach which is more of the 00:12:03.180 --> 00:12:07.949 term which is the approach taken by a lot of other circuits the Third Circuit 00:12:07.949 --> 00:12:10.800 Sixth Circuit Ninth Circuit and Eleventh Circuit so this is the one that's 00:12:10.800 --> 00:12:17.339 particularly relevant here in Hawaii is this idea of a nexus and so here's a 00:12:17.339 --> 00:12:22.079 little bit of an abstract concept so on the first imagine that you've got like 00:12:22.079 --> 00:12:28.709 the easiest example is a retail store and then you have a website and the idea 00:12:28.709 --> 00:12:34.139 behind the nexus theory is that the store is clearly a place of public 00:12:34.139 --> 00:12:38.610 accommodation people go into the store shop they do all their things that they 00:12:38.610 --> 00:12:42.749 do at a normal bricks-and-mortar establishment and then you've got the 00:12:42.749 --> 00:12:47.490 website and somehow we have to establish this connection between this abstract 00:12:47.490 --> 00:12:52.740 concept this website which doesn't really have a place and the actual place 00:12:52.740 --> 00:12:56.819 where the business is located and so we look to things like can you make return 00:12:56.819 --> 00:13:00.839 can you shop on the online website and make returns at the physical store 00:13:00.839 --> 00:13:06.600 can I get coupons at the online site and use them in a physical store can I do 00:13:06.600 --> 00:13:10.649 things like you go to the website and look for the different stores use a 00:13:10.649 --> 00:13:15.209 store locator feature and then know where it is that I can go to find a physical store 00:13:15.209 --> 00:13:19.500 the more connections that we can make like that the greater the nexus or 00:13:19.500 --> 00:13:25.700 connection between the physical store the internet website that there is and 00:13:25.700 --> 00:13:33.570 these jurisdictions these circuits I should say have generally taken that 00:13:33.570 --> 00:13:38.700 position is you have to establish that nexus in order to bring a lawsuit again 00:13:38.700 --> 00:13:42.839 they're developed mostly in the insurance context but the case has cited 00:13:42.839 --> 00:13:47.279 here last it's very often cited case in this context Rendon versus Valleycrest 00:13:47.279 --> 00:13:51.269 Productions that was a case involving that game show Who Wants to Be a 00:13:51.269 --> 00:13:55.709 Millionaire and there was a telephone screening process for it so it's not 00:13:55.709 --> 00:13:59.430 really an internet case but it's kind of close to one because now the service has 00:13:59.430 --> 00:14:03.000 being done over the telephone and you have to punch in your answers really 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:10.680 quickly on a putt on a touch-tone telephone and the that screening process 00:14:10.680 --> 00:14:13.260 was being challenged it's like a website was being challenged because it's not a 00:14:13.260 --> 00:14:18.120 place right and Rendon said I don't know actually that's so much there's enough 00:14:18.120 --> 00:14:22.769 of a connection because it's the gateway to the place that there's a nexus and so 00:14:22.769 --> 00:14:29.990 Rendon that line of reasoning is the same reasoning that's being followed by 00:14:29.990 --> 00:14:35.610 the cases that involve websites in in any of these nexus based jurisdictions 00:14:35.610 --> 00:14:40.829 so as we look at these cases for internet-based cases originally a lot of 00:14:40.829 --> 00:14:47.240 these cases were rejected of course there's a very famous Southwest Airlines 00:14:50.360 --> 00:14:57.660 okay okay so we've got the originally we got a lot of these internet-based 00:14:57.660 --> 00:15:02.010 companies that are being sued i but before all of this there was the 00:15:02.010 --> 00:15:06.959 Southwest Airlines case which kind of that accessibility web web accessibility 00:15:06.959 --> 00:15:13.860 law back a few years where it was basically also using this reasoning but 00:15:13.860 --> 00:15:17.670 more recently we've seen a lot of these internet only companies like Netflix 00:15:17.670 --> 00:15:22.529 getting sued in eBay and Facebook the reason why I said Netflix the case was 00:15:22.529 --> 00:15:25.640 really interesting a couple of slides ago is they almost got sued 00:15:25.640 --> 00:15:31.199 simultaneously both in California and in Massachusetts and the defendant moved to 00:15:31.199 --> 00:15:35.490 made a motion to dismiss in both of those cases and 00:15:35.490 --> 00:15:40.709 remember a motion to dismiss is where you come in and you say you know sorry Your 00:15:40.709 --> 00:15:44.310 Honor the plaintiff doesn't even have it isn't even alleging enough to bring a 00:15:44.310 --> 00:15:50.850 lawsuit right in the one in the case that they brought in Massachusetts 00:15:50.850 --> 00:15:55.890 defendant lost the motion to dismiss because there was no nexus required in 00:15:55.890 --> 00:16:00.779 Cullen which is brought in California they granted the motion to dismiss so 00:16:00.779 --> 00:16:03.779 you get totally opposite results for an internet-based 00:16:03.779 --> 00:16:08.160 company based upon whether you got sued in the First circuit versus getting 00:16:08.160 --> 00:16:15.420 sued in the Ninth circuit so more recently though we the cases in the in 00:16:15.420 --> 00:16:18.810 these nexus based jurisdictions have been finding liability because as I said 00:16:18.810 --> 00:16:23.220 before the Internet's really matured and so there's much more of a connection now 00:16:23.220 --> 00:16:27.510 between these abstract between what happens on the website and what happens 00:16:27.510 --> 00:16:33.209 in a physical store so a great case for that is you know Gomez but I'm sorry 00:16:33.209 --> 00:16:38.310 Gilbert is Winn-Dixie that's a great case or looking at to see the how 00:16:38.310 --> 00:16:42.540 that connection plays out because they looked at store locator features they 00:16:42.540 --> 00:16:45.930 looked at things like being able to get coupons and things like that that were 00:16:45.930 --> 00:16:52.380 available on the website for actually looking in a physical store for actually 00:16:52.380 --> 00:16:57.839 accessing thing goods and services in a physical store now I've been talking a 00:16:57.839 --> 00:17:02.279 lot about Ninth Circuit because obviously it's relevant to us and it's a 00:17:02.279 --> 00:17:07.110 nexus based jurisdiction a Ninth Circuit is basically the whole west coast of the 00:17:07.110 --> 00:17:14.280 United States and Hawaii and Alaska but within the Ninth Circuit there's one 00:17:14.280 --> 00:17:19.740 little caveat which is California in California you can be sued for some 00:17:19.740 --> 00:17:23.819 under California state law under what's called the Unruh and disabled persons 00:17:23.819 --> 00:17:28.439 Act and that is an entirely different ball of wax there's no nexus requirement 00:17:28.439 --> 00:17:34.440 there it's extremely broad they have liquidated and treble damages you know 00:17:34.440 --> 00:17:38.370 so it's I think forty five hundred dollars per claim if you win and in 00:17:38.370 --> 00:17:42.420 California and three times your actual damages so it's quite a it's quite 00:17:42.420 --> 00:17:49.049 onerous in California and it's it's one of the unsettled issues is 00:17:49.049 --> 00:17:56.250 the ability to go after a non California defendant but I'm not obviously not 00:17:56.250 --> 00:18:00.360 going to get into that just be just and be careful of account California the 00:18:00.360 --> 00:18:06.210 third approach is what happens in the Second circuit which is basically New 00:18:06.210 --> 00:18:10.169 York here they kind of go they kind of split the difference between those two 00:18:10.169 --> 00:18:20.520 circuits the other approaches and so in this case they focus in and on the idea 00:18:20.520 --> 00:18:25.590 that the language of that of title 3 of the ADA a doesn't say it has to occur at 00:18:25.590 --> 00:18:30.690 a place of public accommodation its services of a place of public 00:18:30.690 --> 00:18:36.210 accommodation now this argument actually didn't originate in the Eleventh and Second 00:18:36.210 --> 00:18:41.549 Circuit it originally started in Hookes versus okay bridge which is the case 00:18:41.549 --> 00:18:47.010 that I was working on with the appellate section at justice and the attorney who 00:18:47.010 --> 00:18:53.610 was in the appellate section writing the writing the brief he made this argument 00:18:53.610 --> 00:18:59.480 and I thought wow that's that's really splitting hairs I don't I don't buy that 00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:04.409 anyways somebody did and that was the Second Circuit they what they went for 00:19:04.409 --> 00:19:08.340 that again developed in the insurance context one of the things that's 00:19:08.340 --> 00:19:13.409 interesting is that when it actually plays out it has some interesting 00:19:13.409 --> 00:19:18.299 consequences because it's much broader than the Nexus approach because it's 00:19:18.299 --> 00:19:21.659 basically anything that of a place of public accommodation so you don't 00:19:21.659 --> 00:19:25.890 have to break that nexus like as clearly as you do in those like you do in the 00:19:25.890 --> 00:19:30.990 Ninth Circuit but then it doesn't really cover internet only business either you 00:19:30.990 --> 00:19:37.289 still have to have a place that has goods and services um so it is kind of 00:19:37.289 --> 00:19:41.460 splitting the difference a really good case to see is Andrews versus Blick Art 00:19:41.460 --> 00:19:45.419 Materials that's referenced on this slide it gives a really good rundown of 00:19:45.419 --> 00:19:52.140 all the different circuits and a decent analysis so with that that was a really 00:19:52.140 --> 00:19:57.029 quick review of the crazy world of private sector web accessibility public 00:19:57.029 --> 00:20:02.790 sector is a lot easier it all the reason why public sector is easier is 00:20:02.790 --> 00:20:09.480 language and the whole framework of title of public sector so reading this 00:20:09.480 --> 00:20:12.540 is that comes out of title 2 of the ad a subject to the provisions of the 00:20:12.540 --> 00:20:16.410 subchapter no qualified individual with disabilities shall by reason of such 00:20:16.410 --> 00:20:20.820 disability be excluded from participation in or do not be denied the 00:20:20.820 --> 00:20:25.860 benefits of services programs activities or activities of a public entity or be 00:20:25.860 --> 00:20:32.490 subjected to discrimination by any such entity it's much more flexible in its 00:20:32.490 --> 00:20:36.630 approach we those of us who work entitled to talk about this concept 00:20:36.630 --> 00:20:41.430 called program access it's the same concept that also it's almost the exact 00:20:41.430 --> 00:20:47.310 same context as content exact same concept did you see in section 504 of 00:20:47.310 --> 00:20:52.740 the Rehabilitation Act which deals with any kind of federal funding and if say 00:20:52.740 --> 00:20:58.800 you're dealing with a federal agency Oh like OCR a Department of Ed just for 00:20:58.800 --> 00:21:05.820 instance they focus in on that because in the context of universities they've 00:21:05.820 --> 00:21:08.220 taken the position that if you receive student loans 00:21:08.220 --> 00:21:13.080 you're basically receiving federal funding and so you're subject to section 00:21:13.080 --> 00:21:19.980 504 the idea is that you wanted if you're offering a program service or 00:21:19.980 --> 00:21:24.030 activity there's a variety of different ways in which you can offer that to the 00:21:24.030 --> 00:21:28.740 public not every one of those ways has to be perfectly accessible to people 00:21:28.740 --> 00:21:34.050 with disabilities the idea is that you want to make that program accessible to 00:21:34.050 --> 00:21:37.140 people with disabilities and not discriminate against people with 00:21:37.140 --> 00:21:41.490 disabilities so it gives you a little bit of flexibility the seminal case here 00:21:41.490 --> 00:21:46.260 is Martin versus Martin versus Marta which is the Metropolitan Atlanta 00:21:46.260 --> 00:21:52.230 Regional Transit Authority a site is on a slide and it was a 2002 case and it 00:21:52.230 --> 00:21:58.050 really does exemplify this concept because in Martin versus Marta some disabled 00:21:58.050 --> 00:22:04.920 a plaintiff sued the Marta which is like the regional transportation system in 00:22:04.920 --> 00:22:12.060 Atlanta or being inaccessible and the the plaintiff said well you know I can't 00:22:12.060 --> 00:22:16.210 access the train schedules that are available online 00:22:16.210 --> 00:22:20.860 and the defendant said look we offer those train schedules in a variety of 00:22:20.860 --> 00:22:24.039 different ways so that they can so if you're a person with a disability you 00:22:24.039 --> 00:22:29.259 can access them we will send you them in Braille well you can call us and we'll 00:22:29.259 --> 00:22:33.549 be happy to tell you all the information that you want that you need and then 00:22:33.549 --> 00:22:36.970 we've got it on our website and the plaintiff said oh that's all well and 00:22:36.970 --> 00:22:42.009 good but when I call your number you never answer it when you send me your 00:22:42.009 --> 00:22:45.519 schedule it's always out of date because it takes it takes so long to get the 00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:48.519 schedule in Braille and by the time I get it the schedule is out of date so 00:22:48.519 --> 00:22:55.059 it's useless to me and your websites inaccessible so in that case the court 00:22:55.059 --> 00:22:59.320 said sorry defendant you got to provide you're not meeting the program access 00:22:59.320 --> 00:23:03.970 requirement program in that case is access to schedule information for using 00:23:03.970 --> 00:23:08.619 the combination of buses and rails to get around Atlanta but it's a good it 00:23:08.619 --> 00:23:12.340 doesn't say that where the website had to be accessible it said that that 00:23:12.340 --> 00:23:17.320 program of providing transit information has to be accessible one way that they 00:23:17.320 --> 00:23:25.059 can make that accessible is by providing it through a website so in another cases 00:23:25.059 --> 00:23:30.369 Hindle versus Hosted I think that had to do with voter registration on websites 00:23:30.369 --> 00:23:36.519 yeah that's it and I mentioned here at the bottom public sector continues to 00:23:36.519 --> 00:23:44.379 get pressure from OCR DOJ and recent litigation so yeah DOJ and yeah 00:23:44.379 --> 00:23:49.139 definitely OCR Department of Ed are still very much pushing on the idea of 00:23:49.139 --> 00:23:56.379 of accessibility in web hosting or less so and I'll get to that in a little 00:23:56.379 --> 00:24:02.320 while and just last week there was another case filed and in Minnesota 00:24:02.320 --> 00:24:08.740 against Carver County or their website that deals with videos with 00:24:08.740 --> 00:24:14.409 this whole idea of program access so defenses should now these defenses apply 00:24:14.409 --> 00:24:20.080 to any kind of organization so there'll be relevance to be whether you're public 00:24:20.080 --> 00:24:27.700 or private sector remember there's this idea of one of the concepts that title 00:24:27.700 --> 00:24:31.390 three and title to deal with is providing access for people with 00:24:31.390 --> 00:24:35.590 disabilities and including people with sensory disabilities and there's this 00:24:35.590 --> 00:24:39.730 concept within both title 2 and title 3 or public and private sector of 00:24:39.730 --> 00:24:43.360 effective communication doesn't necessarily mean perfect communication 00:24:43.360 --> 00:24:47.919 it means effective communication so for instance if you're providing a you're 00:24:47.919 --> 00:24:53.950 providing a presentation is there a sign language interpreter available doesn't 00:24:53.950 --> 00:24:56.710 have to be made available immediately but can a person with a disability 00:24:56.710 --> 00:24:59.950 request a sign language interpreter and be provided with a sign language 00:24:59.950 --> 00:25:03.970 interpreter that's an example of effective communication well what 00:25:03.970 --> 00:25:07.299 happens if you if you don't make your website accessible and you just provide 00:25:07.299 --> 00:25:10.270 a telephone number that you get the same information it's available on your 00:25:10.270 --> 00:25:15.280 website that's available on your through telephone is that good enough for 00:25:15.280 --> 00:25:22.659 somebody who's blind for instance that's a really interesting case in the cases 00:25:22.659 --> 00:25:27.940 that have it's been rejected in most case in access and Blue Apron and Dave & 00:25:27.940 --> 00:25:32.320 Buster's it's mostly been rejected but again remember these are all at the 00:25:32.320 --> 00:25:37.179 motion to dismiss stage so at that point the court is saying well based on the 00:25:37.179 --> 00:25:43.360 evidence and plaintiffs allegations there's not enough here to suggest that 00:25:43.360 --> 00:25:47.710 it really is effective communication we have to go through discovery before you 00:25:47.710 --> 00:25:51.130 know and really find out the facts before we could just dismiss the case 00:25:51.130 --> 00:25:57.480 that preceded this argument was accepted however in part and Domino's Pizza so 00:25:57.480 --> 00:26:05.700 it's it's Domino's Pizza the Roble's case is kinda is a bit of a outlier case so 00:26:05.710 --> 00:26:11.380 yeah be careful with that but it is out there it was firmly rejected in that 00:26:11.380 --> 00:26:17.880 last case Cala this California Superior Court case on Thurston versus Midvale so 00:26:17.880 --> 00:26:24.190 yeah it's it is as I mention at the bottom of slides again it's hard to read 00:26:24.190 --> 00:26:28.270 that much into them because they're all motion to dismiss stage but it's still 00:26:28.270 --> 00:26:33.520 useful to try to remember these things another one is failure to state a claim 00:26:33.520 --> 00:26:38.049 so this is where this comes up in the context where a plaintiff comes in and 00:26:38.049 --> 00:26:42.669 he says it doesn't allege that this website discriminated against him in the 00:26:42.669 --> 00:26:45.910 sum said he was denied communication he says that the site 00:26:45.910 --> 00:26:50.530 doesn't meet WCAG 2.0 that's the allegation 00:26:50.530 --> 00:26:56.380 so WCAG 2.0 isn't really required by any regulation it's used by the Justice 00:26:56.380 --> 00:27:00.490 Department it's used by OCR at the Department of ED as a standard in settlement 00:27:00.490 --> 00:27:04.600 agreements but it's not an actual standard that's used that's required 00:27:04.600 --> 00:27:11.740 under the current regulations and so this argument was accepted and again the 00:27:11.740 --> 00:27:21.220 Roble's case and it's yeah it's Roble's is very interesting read I should say I 00:27:21.220 --> 00:27:26.250 mean just if you're if you want to make this argument be sure to see that case 00:27:26.250 --> 00:27:33.490 now this lack of specific guidance by the lack of a standard that's used by 00:27:33.490 --> 00:27:39.640 DOJ and OCR and the federal government in the a DEA raises a due process 00:27:39.640 --> 00:27:44.970 concern and this is at the same time because it's basically the due process 00:27:44.970 --> 00:27:50.620 argument basically goes like this does that I was never put on notice of the 00:27:50.620 --> 00:27:55.990 fact I as a person who created this website was never put on notice that I 00:27:55.990 --> 00:28:00.880 had to make my website meet a set of standards or make it accessible 00:28:00.880 --> 00:28:05.440 you know because our to meet WCAG with a web content accessibility 00:28:05.440 --> 00:28:09.490 guidelines because nobody ever told me that there are no regulations that say 00:28:09.490 --> 00:28:14.740 that so dismiss this case and that argument was raised in Domino's Pizza 00:28:14.740 --> 00:28:19.720 it's a due process argument though never really succeeds it's also been raised in 00:28:19.720 --> 00:28:25.270 a number of other cases and never really succeeds it has come up in a different 00:28:25.270 --> 00:28:30.220 context which I'll get to which led to a move by Congress to bar ad a web cases 00:28:30.220 --> 00:28:34.870 and there's a fight at the bottom to an article that describes up third defense 00:28:34.870 --> 00:28:39.490 is standing to sue this is what comes up in credit union cases for some reason 00:28:39.490 --> 00:28:44.080 this is where you've got a plaintiff who lives nowhere close to you and they live 00:28:44.080 --> 00:28:48.430 hundreds of miles away they really show no interest in becoming your customer or 00:28:48.430 --> 00:28:52.450 they might not even be eligible to become your customer but they sue 00:28:52.450 --> 00:28:57.190 anyways remember there's thousands of web accessibility cases what do you 00:28:57.190 --> 00:29:01.030 you in that case well the National Association of Federally Insured Credit 00:29:01.030 --> 00:29:05.020 Unions or NAFICU has been vigorously defending those cases and they've been 00:29:05.020 --> 00:29:07.240 succeeding they've been generally they've been 00:29:07.240 --> 00:29:10.660 doing really well and getting these cases kicked out and they're so sick and 00:29:10.660 --> 00:29:14.530 tired of these cases that they've gone to Congress and they they've pitched 00:29:14.530 --> 00:29:18.010 this idea to that DOJ has got to come up with their rulemaking and I'll get to 00:29:18.010 --> 00:29:23.110 the DOJ rulemaking in a second but this defense isn't always successful for 00:29:23.110 --> 00:29:28.690 instance in this Jones versus Lanier Federal Credit Union which was only 00:29:28.690 --> 00:29:38.280 about a week or two ago the court rejected that and said well the 00:29:38.280 --> 00:29:43.420 reasoning basically of Jones is that just the fact that you were basically 00:29:43.420 --> 00:29:48.850 insulted doesn't quite use those words by this inaccessible website and you had 00:29:48.850 --> 00:29:52.210 to deal with all these barriers is enough of an injury even if you never 00:29:52.210 --> 00:29:56.470 intended to become a actual customer it's a little bit shaky I think that 00:29:56.470 --> 00:30:00.400 most of the course tend to favor this argument as opposed to disfavor it but 00:30:00.400 --> 00:30:06.340 anyways another defense which is really common is mootness this is comes up 00:30:06.340 --> 00:30:10.480 where you get sued by one plaintiff and then another and you say okay I'm gonna 00:30:10.480 --> 00:30:14.200 go and fix my website and then while you're fixing your website somebody else 00:30:14.200 --> 00:30:19.150 comes along and sues you and says your website's not accessible and then you 00:30:19.150 --> 00:30:22.690 know defendant makes the argument but look I settled the first guy well I 00:30:22.690 --> 00:30:27.640 should I and I'm in the process of making this site accessible you can't 00:30:27.640 --> 00:30:32.370 sue me a second somebody else can't sue me well that argument gets rejected 00:30:32.370 --> 00:30:39.160 sorry in most cases the the key case here is this recent one it only came out 00:30:39.160 --> 00:30:41.830 gosh couple of months ago Hanes versus 00:30:41.830 --> 00:30:47.590 Hooters of America Hooters restaurant now that's basically in fact the scenario 00:30:47.590 --> 00:30:52.690 on Hooters and basically the court said no that's not good enough because we you 00:30:52.690 --> 00:30:56.950 have no get the second plaintiff has no guarantee that you're really going to 00:30:56.950 --> 00:31:01.870 follow through on the first plaintiffs agreements and the second plaintiff is 00:31:01.870 --> 00:31:06.340 injured separately from how that first plaintiff was injured unless you can 00:31:06.340 --> 00:31:11.049 show that the defendants site was cleaned up enough that 00:31:11.049 --> 00:31:15.759 didn't affect the second plaintiff then you don't get to succeed in that 00:31:15.759 --> 00:31:21.429 argument okay personal jurisdiction so this happen is 00:31:21.429 --> 00:31:26.970 the last defense that comes up and I thought this case was really interesting 00:31:26.970 --> 00:31:33.249 Access now sued this corporation Sportswear Inc Sportswear Inc was based 00:31:33.249 --> 00:31:39.879 in Seattle and they were based in Boston which I thought was very ironic 00:31:39.879 --> 00:31:43.690 combination because my company's based in Boston and I live in Seattle 00:31:43.690 --> 00:31:49.119 so anyways it's a West Coast online company that sold sportswear basically 00:31:49.119 --> 00:31:54.789 it's things like they may actually be one of your suppliers because they do 00:31:54.789 --> 00:31:59.529 things like universities and sports teams sweatshirts and they print them up 00:31:59.529 --> 00:32:03.249 and they send them out to all these different schools that it's rules can 00:32:03.249 --> 00:32:10.149 tell them basically and so they also sell online and so a Massachusetts based 00:32:10.149 --> 00:32:15.070 plaintiff sued this company in Seattle but they sued them in Massachusetts and 00:32:15.070 --> 00:32:21.669 in the Seattle company said hey we have no connection the Massachusetts we just 00:32:21.669 --> 00:32:26.470 have a website and the court said no the plaintiff can still see you in 00:32:26.470 --> 00:32:32.559 Massachusetts because you sold you made a mistake of selling sweatshirts that 00:32:32.559 --> 00:32:39.940 had Massachusetts sports teams brand logoed on them and if you happen to live 00:32:39.940 --> 00:32:44.619 in Seattle and you're a Seahawks fan and you're selling stuff that's branded with 00:32:44.619 --> 00:32:51.519 the Patriots that Patriots logo well you deserve to get but that's a for obvious 00:32:51.519 --> 00:32:58.210 reason but apart from that they said well you're really trying to derive 00:32:58.210 --> 00:33:02.169 income and you're making your marketing efforts towards that bugs at 00:33:02.169 --> 00:33:06.190 jurisdiction of Massachusetts now it's very strategic because remember that 00:33:06.190 --> 00:33:11.919 Seattle West Coast Ninth circuit Massachusetts First circuit so First 00:33:11.919 --> 00:33:16.600 circuit there's no nexus requirement though you can be sued in Massachusetts 00:33:16.600 --> 00:33:23.169 even though you are even though you live in a nexus based jurisdiction okay let 00:33:23.169 --> 00:33:28.070 me try and really quickly wrap up here elsewhere in the news we've got these 00:33:28.070 --> 00:33:33.230 are things that are happening at mostly at the federal agencies I keep in touch 00:33:33.230 --> 00:33:37.910 a lot with some of my friends and the federal agencies so we've got the DOJ 00:33:37.910 --> 00:33:42.770 rulemaking back in 2010 the DOJ decided that they wanted to add a little bit of 00:33:42.770 --> 00:33:47.570 meat up to the bones become when it dealt with web accessibility and so on 00:33:47.570 --> 00:33:52.640 the anniversary of the ADA but I guess it was a 20th anniversary 00:33:52.640 --> 00:33:57.260 yeah the 20th anniversary of the ADA a they issued a advance notice of proposed 00:33:57.260 --> 00:34:02.000 rulemaking and at this stage they're basically just asking questions about 00:34:02.000 --> 00:34:05.990 what they should do about the web you know what should the standards be who 00:34:05.990 --> 00:34:12.020 should be liable when should they be liable things like that and then they 00:34:12.020 --> 00:34:19.070 just sat around and waited it was really disappointing six years go by and then 00:34:19.070 --> 00:34:23.960 they issue another set of questions in what's called a supplemental advanced 00:34:23.960 --> 00:34:30.050 notice of proposed rulemaking or an SANPRM and he just has more 00:34:30.050 --> 00:34:37.760 questions and then the administration changes and so all of a sudden this rule 00:34:37.760 --> 00:34:42.530 that was being developed gets put on hold and so now it's on the inactive 00:34:42.530 --> 00:34:48.770 list so DOJ is currently not in and rulemaking and then they pulled it 00:34:48.770 --> 00:34:52.640 entirely they said we're not going to do anything into some on this in December 00:34:52.640 --> 00:34:57.650 26th of last year and if you've been following the news you are if you 00:34:57.650 --> 00:35:00.680 remember what I said a couple of slides ago how the National Association of 00:35:00.680 --> 00:35:04.490 Federal Credit Union's has been lobbying Congress to tell DOJ to come up with a 00:35:04.490 --> 00:35:13.960 rulemaking they got some congressmen do send the letter to DOJ DOJ said sorry 00:35:13.960 --> 00:35:18.230 websites are probably required to be accessible but we're not going to tell 00:35:18.230 --> 00:35:26.600 you how and WCAG yeah it's a standard that's out there but and we may require 00:35:26.600 --> 00:35:30.740 it we may not you know it was totally wishy-washy and what they were it 00:35:30.740 --> 00:35:35.630 basically gave it basically gave no guidance and I do not think that we're 00:35:35.630 --> 00:35:40.450 gonna see a DOJ rulemaking anytime soon that's unfortunate because it's really 00:35:40.450 --> 00:35:45.900 needed but both the private sector and public sector are lobbying for this but 00:35:45.900 --> 00:35:53.110 for the private I'm sorry both need potential defendants and a potential 00:35:53.110 --> 00:35:57.910 plaintiffs I should say are both lobbying for this because the disability 00:35:57.910 --> 00:36:02.290 groups disability rights groups want it because if they can add some certain 00:36:02.290 --> 00:36:06.760 clarity around what's required then they can go and advocate for improvements and 00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:11.530 accessibility and if the potential defendants know about what they have to 00:36:11.530 --> 00:36:15.400 do then they can build to a specific set of standards so they know what wouldn't 00:36:15.400 --> 00:36:19.690 know what to do so everybody's pushing for it but nobody nobody's going to do 00:36:19.690 --> 00:36:25.000 anything about it okay ah it's even worse at the Department of Education and 00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:35.950 it so yeah a good friend of mine told me about this happening about oh more than 00:36:35.950 --> 00:36:41.740 a year ago so there are new regulations that they created a regulation that 00:36:41.740 --> 00:36:47.080 allowed them to close cases from any complaints from any stereo complainant 00:36:47.080 --> 00:36:53.350 there is there was one complainant at who filed thousands of cases with OCR 00:36:53.350 --> 00:36:57.550 and this involved lots of school districts lots of universities around 00:36:57.550 --> 00:37:05.859 the country and they said well with places of burden on our agency to have 00:37:05.859 --> 00:37:10.990 to investigate all of her complaints we don't have to investigate them and so 00:37:10.990 --> 00:37:15.940 they issued a regulation that basically said that and that's a real change from 00:37:15.940 --> 00:37:23.590 the way that OCR had worked in the past then they they closed a lot of their 00:37:23.590 --> 00:37:30.220 existing investigations that dealt with web accessibility and then they started 00:37:30.220 --> 00:37:35.170 reopening the existing agreements that they had so if you are under a consent 00:37:35.170 --> 00:37:39.790 decree or in all not a consent decree if you were under a basically settlement 00:37:39.790 --> 00:37:43.390 agreement or a voluntary resolution agreement with the part with OCR 00:37:43.390 --> 00:37:50.859 Department of Ed and you went back to CR and said look I know we agreed that we 00:37:50.859 --> 00:37:55.530 were going to make our website completely comply with WCAG 00:37:55.530 --> 00:38:00.180 2.0 double A but I don't thought I think that's really I think that's a bit 00:38:00.180 --> 00:38:07.230 tough for us OCR has been saying okay let's reconsider it and they they've 00:38:07.230 --> 00:38:13.670 been doing exactly that and so base and so basically 00:38:14.130 --> 00:38:17.940 show that you've gotten you're making a good-faith effort while that's good 00:38:17.940 --> 00:38:21.330 enough we're not gonna you're not gonna have to do all the ownerís things we 00:38:21.330 --> 00:38:27.900 originally required you do and so this has led to some lawsuits against the 00:38:27.900 --> 00:38:33.510 agency by disability rights groups and disability advocates and it's kind of 00:38:33.510 --> 00:38:37.170 insulting it the way in which they respond to this is well Department of 00:38:37.170 --> 00:38:43.470 Education says well instead of doing that instead of you know instead of 00:38:43.470 --> 00:38:48.720 doing all these investigations and and not popping to reopen these existing 00:38:48.720 --> 00:38:52.080 agreements that the defendants agreed to let's just give some technical and 00:38:52.080 --> 00:38:56.090 permit technical assistance on how to make your website comply with 00:38:56.090 --> 00:39:01.470 accessibility requirements and to me that just is like an insult to all the 00:39:01.470 --> 00:39:06.150 disability advocates out there okay finally good news only good news is 00:39:06.150 --> 00:39:10.890 what's happening the access board they finally came out at the beginning into 00:39:10.890 --> 00:39:17.550 this year with their on section 255 and 508 rule so if you're this basically 00:39:17.550 --> 00:39:24.930 means that if you're acquiring IT technology or a federal agency or you 00:39:24.930 --> 00:39:29.280 have to make sure that that technology meets a set of standards it's a 00:39:29.280 --> 00:39:33.960 procurement regulation it's not really a deceivin though it impacts people with 00:39:33.960 --> 00:39:37.590 disabilities in a really good way it's not really a civil rights law it's it's 00:39:37.590 --> 00:39:42.630 really a procurement law but the neat thing about section 508 is it creates 00:39:42.630 --> 00:39:46.950 the infrastructure that allows individual based accommodations to be 00:39:46.950 --> 00:39:50.970 made so it allows it requires for instance a software be made accessible 00:39:50.970 --> 00:39:55.200 but that means that the software that's deployed throughout an agency for 00:39:55.200 --> 00:39:59.970 instance has to be accessible so for people with disabilities so that they 00:39:59.970 --> 00:40:03.570 can use their screen readers so it's really a positive thing for people with 00:40:03.570 --> 00:40:09.039 disabilities the access board said well okay we're adopting WCAG or 00:40:09.039 --> 00:40:15.220 web content accessibility guidelines into the requirements the only problem 00:40:15.220 --> 00:40:21.549 is they did it in kind of a abstract way with no guidance and they and they 00:40:21.549 --> 00:40:25.599 also did it very broadly so they said even though while it's these are set of 00:40:25.599 --> 00:40:30.999 web guidelines we're gonna apply web WCAG to everything multimedia software 00:40:30.999 --> 00:40:35.710 all these technologies aren't what necessarily web based and it's led to a 00:40:35.710 --> 00:40:43.089 lot of confusion but it's still positive it also uses WCAG 2.0 and well now 00:40:43.089 --> 00:40:47.950 we've got WCAG 2.1 and we're not exactly clear on how that interplays 00:40:47.950 --> 00:40:53.470 with a current 508 standards in terms of like how this all should be interpreted 00:40:53.470 --> 00:41:00.069 the one thing that they don't do is give guidance to a set of regulations that I 00:41:00.069 --> 00:41:05.019 think they should give guidance to which is EN 301549 which is a European 00:41:05.019 --> 00:41:10.269 standard and in Europe they wanted to meld there they wanted to harmonize 00:41:10.269 --> 00:41:13.989 their requirements with the US requirements and in order to do that 00:41:13.989 --> 00:41:17.259 they wanted to make their procurement regulations look like the u.s. 00:41:17.259 --> 00:41:22.779 regulations and so they came up with the EN 301549 if you look that up on the 00:41:22.779 --> 00:41:28.960 web and you download the actual regulation it it it gives a map a very 00:41:28.960 --> 00:41:34.599 good mapping of how WCAG 2.0 gets translated into software how it gets 00:41:34.599 --> 00:41:39.039 translated into a multimedia presentation which requirements you need 00:41:39.039 --> 00:41:42.880 you know howdy which one a detect it doesn't go down to and like the 00:41:42.880 --> 00:41:49.029 technique level to tell you which specific advisory guidance elements you 00:41:49.029 --> 00:41:52.180 should be following the things like that but it does give a lot more specificity 00:41:52.180 --> 00:41:56.259 there how do you interpret WCAG to something that was never 00:41:56.259 --> 00:42:00.069 web-based to begin with okay I'm gonna finish up with where 00:42:00.069 --> 00:42:03.609 things are going really quickly US litigation is only going to keep in 00:42:03.609 --> 00:42:09.099 continuing we all the action right now is all in the all in the private sector 00:42:09.099 --> 00:42:13.839 with plaintiffs suing both public entities and private entities it don't 00:42:13.839 --> 00:42:19.540 look through don't look to federal agencies to be 00:42:19.540 --> 00:42:27.120 doing the lion's share of litigation in the the rest of the world though is 00:42:27.120 --> 00:42:33.250 catching up with us or surpassing us the EU is has new web as a new web 00:42:33.250 --> 00:42:41.020 accessibility directive that has to be adopted by the Member States very 00:42:41.020 --> 00:42:46.950 shortly and they're moving towards web accessibility as a requirement 00:42:46.950 --> 00:42:52.150 universally for everything in the public sector and around the world we see a lot 00:42:52.150 --> 00:43:00.460 of nations doing the same thing Asia and Europe in particular and some countries 00:43:00.460 --> 00:43:08.500 such as Norway and Korea and in really and and the UK also have been focusing 00:43:08.500 --> 00:43:14.260 also a lot more on private sector we're seeing a very slow migration to WCAG 00:43:14.260 --> 00:43:18.790 2.1 even even though they came out and everybody's saying well you know we 00:43:18.790 --> 00:43:22.180 should be adopting - we should be conforming to the latest standards the 00:43:22.180 --> 00:43:26.800 issue there is that the advisory guidance that goes along with that has 00:43:26.800 --> 00:43:31.600 and is still being fleshed out though and the settlement agreements that we're 00:43:31.600 --> 00:43:36.940 still seeing are still focusing mostly on WCAG 2.0 though I'm that's my 00:43:36.940 --> 00:43:42.400 presentation and I guess it took 42 minutes so we're not too far over and I 00:43:42.400 --> 00:43:45.870 guess we could take a couple of questions before we move on to the next 00:43:45.870 --> 00:43:57.070 element we have a few questions from the web Thunny from Hilo as three questions 00:43:57.070 --> 00:44:03.730 his first question is if we post an accessible web page of a PDF on a 00:44:03.730 --> 00:44:09.850 website and link to the non-compliant PDF or the same content on that page are 00:44:09.850 --> 00:44:15.220 we meeting compliance okay that's a good question I would say that provides 00:44:15.220 --> 00:44:19.990 effective communication yeah so if you if you provide the excessive as long as 00:44:19.990 --> 00:44:26.020 the content that you're providing actually replicates the PDF then that's 00:44:26.020 --> 00:44:30.310 that's really what you're getting at anyways the fact that you linked it off 00:44:30.310 --> 00:44:33.990 to other content that's potentially inaccessible 00:44:33.990 --> 00:44:44.230 that to me into my mind isn't that problematic this next question is do all 00:44:44.230 --> 00:44:49.780 these circuits matter to us because we're in the public sector and do we 00:44:49.780 --> 00:44:55.390 have a basic standard to meet regardless of the circuit okay yeah that's a really 00:44:55.390 --> 00:44:58.960 good question yeah I mentioned before I have to go into all the discussion about 00:44:58.960 --> 00:45:03.460 the private sector because that's where a lot of the action is no I mean those 00:45:03.460 --> 00:45:07.450 those ideas are really relevant to you only in the context of when you're 00:45:07.450 --> 00:45:10.990 dealing if you have if you have partner organizations that are in a private 00:45:10.990 --> 00:45:15.910 sector then that's where the split in the circuits comes in still be looking 00:45:15.910 --> 00:45:18.880 to WCAG 2.0 double A as your standard even though the federal 00:45:18.880 --> 00:45:22.630 government doesn't say that I think of it as a safe harbor because if you get 00:45:22.630 --> 00:45:26.650 sued by someone if you could sue by DOJ or you get investigated by DOJ or OCR 00:45:26.650 --> 00:45:31.570 they're going to ultimately settle at WCAG 2.0 though it's it's 00:45:31.570 --> 00:45:36.580 effectively a safe harbor and the sense that if you meet that then you're pretty 00:45:36.580 --> 00:45:45.130 immune to suit lastly how do the requirements go in terms of social media 00:45:45.130 --> 00:45:52.840 platforms do our WCAG do requirements reach into such things as going live on 00:45:52.840 --> 00:45:59.320 Facebook yeah they do but it depends so remember it's all dependent upon your 00:45:59.320 --> 00:46:04.510 program services and activities right so the question becomes well what is that 00:46:04.510 --> 00:46:08.680 surf program service or activity if you're heavily relying on Facebook or 00:46:08.680 --> 00:46:12.370 you're relying on social media or one of those other third-party content 00:46:12.370 --> 00:46:18.460 providers social media providers to provide that program or service or 00:46:18.460 --> 00:46:22.540 activity yeah then you're gonna have to you're gonna have to do something to 00:46:22.540 --> 00:46:26.680 make sure that that's possible but if you're using that just as an 00:46:26.680 --> 00:46:32.500 adjunct that to another form of communication that provides that that 00:46:32.500 --> 00:46:38.680 that poor content or that core program service or activity then that 00:46:38.680 --> 00:46:44.890 third-party content is it's not it's not because it's not the only way of getting 00:46:44.890 --> 00:46:49.600 to that program service or activity the need to make that accessible just 00:46:49.600 --> 00:47:04.170 drop significantly okay about it okay are there any other questions yeah I 00:47:04.170 --> 00:47:09.550 don't know maybe I missed it but did you I was really surprised to see this kind 00:47:09.550 --> 00:47:14.109 of exponential explosion of lawsuits around this stuff just in the recent 00:47:14.109 --> 00:47:18.880 years I mean I did do you have is there a good under reason to understand why 00:47:18.880 --> 00:47:23.350 this happened oh yeah so that's a really good question the reason this is because 00:47:23.350 --> 00:47:28.990 it's so easy to bring these lawsuits but the plaintiffs bar is really jumped in 00:47:28.990 --> 00:47:33.040 on this when you think about like a drive-by lawsuit normally you have to go 00:47:33.040 --> 00:47:39.070 and find a plaintiff go to a physical facility and actually encounter some 00:47:39.070 --> 00:47:43.990 discrimination like encounter physical barriers for instance in this context 00:47:43.990 --> 00:47:47.890 the only thing that you have to do is hop on the web from the safety of your 00:47:47.890 --> 00:47:52.359 office run an online scanning tool against that website call your friend 00:47:52.359 --> 00:47:57.550 who's blind and say hey I'm encountering some some barriers using this automated 00:47:57.550 --> 00:48:00.820 testing tool what do you think when you go to this website oh yeah I can't use 00:48:00.820 --> 00:48:05.590 it with screenreader okay bang you got your lawsuit so it's you can just sit at 00:48:05.590 --> 00:48:13.300 home and generate lawsuits okay so we're under a bit of a time crisis so I guess 00:48:13.300 --> 00:48:18.460 we should start in on the next presentation which completely changes 00:48:18.460 --> 00:48:22.890 prac so let me pull that up 00:48:28.820 --> 00:48:43.310 here we go okay from start okay so completely changing gears now now we are 00:48:43.310 --> 00:48:50.150 not going to talk about the legal stuff what we gave two presentations not that 00:48:50.150 --> 00:48:55.130 long ago and the idea behind giving them was a lot of this stuff that deals with 00:48:55.130 --> 00:49:00.250 web accessibility is kind of abstract to a lot of people and we wanted to 00:49:00.250 --> 00:49:04.010 describe what is this thing that I've been talking about the web content 00:49:04.010 --> 00:49:07.670 accessibility guidelines and why does it affect people with disabilities why does 00:49:07.670 --> 00:49:11.990 it matter and how do I understand this WCAG 00:49:11.990 --> 00:49:15.740 like when you if you ever look take a look at it and try to understand it it's 00:49:15.740 --> 00:49:20.750 it's really quite daunting to read and so we wanted to make sure that people 00:49:20.750 --> 00:49:26.360 who are both technical and non-technical had some understanding about well what 00:49:26.360 --> 00:49:31.700 it is and after that and then we'll give another presentation about okay now do 00:49:31.700 --> 00:49:33.130 you understand it what do you do about it 00:49:33.130 --> 00:49:40.700 so this presentation has basically three parts three goals the first part is we 00:49:40.700 --> 00:49:43.490 want to understand what web accessibility is and well how does it 00:49:43.490 --> 00:49:47.000 can tie into effective communication and I kind of hinted at that in the last 00:49:47.000 --> 00:49:53.030 presentation the second one alik the second idea is for my colleague Jeff 00:49:53.030 --> 00:49:57.170 Singleton to give a practical demonstration of what web accessibility 00:49:57.170 --> 00:50:03.620 means and then lastly we wanted to talk about you know Jeff is going to talk 00:50:03.620 --> 00:50:11.870 about the actual thing that we call WCAG what it is why it exists how is it 00:50:11.870 --> 00:50:18.680 structured how do you read it how do you use it basically so again you know but 00:50:18.680 --> 00:50:21.800 you know me that's my slide I already talked about 00:50:21.800 --> 00:50:25.910 myself don't get a lawyer an opportunity to talk about himself very dangerous 00:50:25.910 --> 00:50:33.770 health thing and so with that we'll go just right past that and get into 00:50:33.770 --> 00:50:42.470 web accessibility so what we're really focused here on is 00:50:42.470 --> 00:50:46.070 how do you make the web accessible and understandable and a natural part of 00:50:46.070 --> 00:50:51.410 what you already know about ADA compliance in terms of title 2 and title 00:50:51.410 --> 00:50:56.270 3 anyways my colleague Jeff is going to talk about the different kinds of 00:50:56.270 --> 00:51:02.420 disabilities that are affected by web accessibility and how how people with 00:51:02.420 --> 00:51:06.470 disabilities actually interact interact with the internet using assistive 00:51:06.470 --> 00:51:13.010 technology then we're gonna dive into a demonstration of what makes in this site 00:51:13.010 --> 00:51:19.790 inaccessible and how to tie that to WCAG which is really what we call what a 00:51:19.790 --> 00:51:24.410 universal design standard and universal design standards are really important in 00:51:24.410 --> 00:51:28.099 the idea in the world of accessibility because you don't want to build a 00:51:28.099 --> 00:51:32.270 building for instance these specific requirements of one user with a 00:51:32.270 --> 00:51:36.680 disability because what happens when the next user with different disabilities or 00:51:36.680 --> 00:51:40.609 different set of disabilities comes and tries to use the building instead what 00:51:40.609 --> 00:51:45.020 we want is we want to create the set of standards that meets both the needs of 00:51:45.020 --> 00:51:49.430 the business community in the sense that it's easy to build the building but we 00:51:49.430 --> 00:51:52.700 also want to incorporate the feedback of as many people with disabilities as 00:51:52.700 --> 00:51:56.720 possible to create a common understanding about how we design a 00:51:56.720 --> 00:52:01.070 building like how wide a door has to be how steep a build a ramp has to be 00:52:01.070 --> 00:52:04.580 that's a universal design stand that we want to create a universal design 00:52:04.580 --> 00:52:09.020 standard and that's what we mean by Universal Design and WCAG the web 00:52:09.020 --> 00:52:13.030 content accessibility guidelines is exactly that it's a universal design 00:52:13.030 --> 00:52:20.450 standard so I wanted to give some a launching point for where this 00:52:20.450 --> 00:52:24.830 discussion is taking off from when we're talking about title 2 and title 3 I 00:52:24.830 --> 00:52:27.980 should have put this slide in my last presentation but there's this idea of 00:52:27.980 --> 00:52:32.210 effective communication and again remember there's that idea that you know 00:52:32.210 --> 00:52:35.540 the communication has to be perfect it doesn't have to be perfect but it has to 00:52:35.540 --> 00:52:40.820 be effective in the context of title 2 which is you guys at the University the 00:52:40.820 --> 00:52:44.480 language is a public entity shall take appropriate steps to ensure that 00:52:44.480 --> 00:52:47.920 communications with applicants participants members of the public and 00:52:47.920 --> 00:52:52.510 companions with disabilities are as effective as communication with others 00:52:52.510 --> 00:52:56.390 so it's pretty broad and it doesn't necessarily mean 00:52:56.390 --> 00:53:02.210 perfect communication just has to be effective in the in the private sector 00:53:02.210 --> 00:53:06.380 context it uses the second paragraph private sector entities are called 00:53:06.380 --> 00:53:10.670 public accommodations infusing but that's what they call them a public 00:53:10.670 --> 00:53:14.210 accommodation shall furnish appropriate auxiliary aids and services were only 00:53:14.210 --> 00:53:17.299 necessary to ensure effective communication with individuals with 00:53:17.299 --> 00:53:20.839 disabilities it's worded quite a bit differently but in a sense the 00:53:20.839 --> 00:53:24.289 requirement is almost exactly the same there are subtle differences between 00:53:24.289 --> 00:53:28.249 title 2 and title 3 in terms of effective communication into regulations 00:53:28.249 --> 00:53:31.970 but I'm not going to get into that so when you think about what effective 00:53:31.970 --> 00:53:36.980 communication is it's things like as I said before providing a sign language 00:53:36.980 --> 00:53:41.749 interpreter for a presentation to make sure that the audio content is made 00:53:41.749 --> 00:53:46.099 accessible to deaf members of the audience but I think a more useful 00:53:46.099 --> 00:53:50.359 example when we're talking about web is imagine you're going to a restaurant and 00:53:50.359 --> 00:53:56.809 the waiter hands you a menu if your sighted that's all well and good if 00:53:56.809 --> 00:54:02.299 you're blind and you get handed a menu well do theirs that's not gonna that's 00:54:02.299 --> 00:54:07.009 not gonna cut it so how does the restaurant provide that ensure effective 00:54:07.009 --> 00:54:11.989 communication with that patron with disability usually it comes down to the 00:54:11.989 --> 00:54:16.970 waiter just reading the menu but sometimes they'll they'll do have an 00:54:16.970 --> 00:54:20.390 audio recording sometimes they'll have a braille menu but when you think about it 00:54:20.390 --> 00:54:26.539 those types of accommodations are very different because one is like it's 00:54:26.539 --> 00:54:31.339 looking forward it's proactive that would be like the audio transcript or 00:54:31.339 --> 00:54:35.059 the Braille version of the menu that's forward-looking 00:54:35.059 --> 00:54:40.190 when we're talking about a waiter just reading the menu that's backward looking 00:54:40.190 --> 00:54:45.470 because it's it it's something that you do ad hoc at the moment right and so and 00:54:45.470 --> 00:54:50.059 it's very individualized when we're dealing with web accessibility we're 00:54:50.059 --> 00:54:53.390 kind of like dealing with that proact we have to be more proactive because you 00:54:53.390 --> 00:54:58.759 know you can't just accommodate the website make accommodations on the 00:54:58.759 --> 00:55:02.839 website on the fly when the person with a disability comes into it you have to 00:55:02.839 --> 00:55:07.009 that's the reason why had to be proactive and in the web you've got 00:55:07.009 --> 00:55:10.280 other complications like you've got multimedia 00:55:10.280 --> 00:55:14.480 you've got the fact that students are accessing the site 24 hours a day and 00:55:14.480 --> 00:55:19.310 that those complications are the things that are really drive us towards this 00:55:19.310 --> 00:55:24.170 need to make sure that we're all not only following we're not only just 00:55:24.170 --> 00:55:28.280 looking ahead and trying to predict what the needs are people with disabilities 00:55:28.280 --> 00:55:34.220 but now because particularly in a university where you've got students 00:55:34.220 --> 00:55:38.840 with disabilities who are accessing the site all the time 24 hours a day seven 00:55:38.840 --> 00:55:42.590 days a week it really becomes necessary to make sure that that content is 00:55:42.590 --> 00:55:48.830 accessible ahead of time so you can't just make the ad-hoc accommodation would 00:55:48.830 --> 00:55:51.800 be saying oh well the website doesn't have to be accessible because we could 00:55:51.800 --> 00:55:55.310 provide a phone operator and the university context that doesn't that 00:55:55.310 --> 00:56:00.620 doesn't really hold up as well because of that need for 24-hour accessibility 00:56:00.620 --> 00:56:04.160 or like a professor posts something and you know the reading assignment is due 00:56:04.160 --> 00:56:07.280 in a week and you know what's gonna happen the students gonna wait till the 00:56:07.280 --> 00:56:11.750 very last opportunity to do the reading assignment and so they're gonna try and 00:56:11.750 --> 00:56:15.560 access it at 2:00 in the morning so you know unless you've got a phone operator 00:56:15.560 --> 00:56:20.750 who's willing to bank a phone operators who are willing to trant.. tell people 00:56:20.750 --> 00:56:25.280 what's on an accessible web site at 3:00 in the morning on Sunday that's not 00:56:25.280 --> 00:56:33.200 going to cut it though there's a much more compelling need to provide the 00:56:33.200 --> 00:56:36.890 development to a universal design standard so with that I'm gonna turn it 00:56:36.890 --> 00:56:43.850 over my colleague Jeff who's going to talk about web accessibility from a it's 00:56:43.850 --> 00:56:50.030 going to continue this discussion about web accessibility and focus in on the 00:56:50.030 --> 00:56:55.190 actual practical needs of users with disabilities in in using assistive 00:56:55.190 --> 00:56:58.810 technology and why this is all important 00:57:12.450 --> 00:57:18.430 I'll just introduce myself as convention I'm Jeff Singleton I work with the same 00:57:18.430 --> 00:57:23.109 company and Cyxtera I work as the senior accessibility consultant and all 00:57:23.109 --> 00:57:26.980 that means is that when we have clients that come to us whether they're using 00:57:26.980 --> 00:57:31.799 our software product or whether they're taking advantage of our consulting 00:57:31.799 --> 00:57:36.789 services sometimes there's questions about what does WCAG mean or section 00:57:36.789 --> 00:57:39.940 508 what are these different accessibility standards mean how do we 00:57:39.940 --> 00:57:43.809 apply them or they might have questions about something they're doing on their 00:57:43.809 --> 00:57:46.960 website but we're gonna make this change but we're not sure if it's the right 00:57:46.960 --> 00:57:51.849 thing to do that's when they come to us like for myself and I'm able to look at 00:57:51.849 --> 00:57:55.509 that and give them some guidance and feedback on what to do about that so 00:57:55.509 --> 00:57:59.140 that's kind of the role I play along with doing these type of lectures with 00:57:59.140 --> 00:58:03.549 Ken and I've been doing this with Ken for about ten years now I believe and 00:58:03.549 --> 00:58:07.779 prior to that I was working for Microsoft and we also some other 00:58:07.779 --> 00:58:12.160 consulting firms working on accessible UI and things like that so we've been 00:58:12.160 --> 00:58:15.460 doing it for a while and we've seen a lot of different ways of doing things 00:58:15.460 --> 00:58:18.910 right and doing things wrong so we have a pretty good grasp of what's going on 00:58:18.910 --> 00:58:23.499 there but when it comes to the topic of web accessibility 00:58:23.499 --> 00:58:27.880 you know it's brought up many times when we think about that most people think 00:58:27.880 --> 00:58:31.450 along the lines of blind news or somebody who can't see but there's so 00:58:31.450 --> 00:58:35.259 many more so much more that goes into that other than just somebody who can't 00:58:35.259 --> 00:58:38.499 see the screen and so we don't want to look over those other areas of 00:58:38.499 --> 00:58:42.190 impairment because then we're going to be finding ourselves in a situation 00:58:42.190 --> 00:58:45.609 where we're having to deal with that possibly an illegal type of complaint or 00:58:45.609 --> 00:58:50.619 something so let's think about some of the different types of impairments first 00:58:50.619 --> 00:58:54.430 one is vision that's usually the first one that comes to mind everybody's kind 00:58:54.430 --> 00:58:58.539 of familiar with that but we also have hearing impairments as well when it 00:58:58.539 --> 00:59:02.920 comes to the web that's usually thought about as far as multimedia things that 00:59:02.920 --> 00:59:04.539 need to be captioned and things like that 00:59:04.539 --> 00:59:09.249 but we also have different mobile apps today as well as some websites that will 00:59:09.249 --> 00:59:13.720 give audio type of feedback so if we're not taking into account the hearing 00:59:13.720 --> 00:59:17.380 impairment and providing some kind of visual indication of those audio 00:59:17.380 --> 00:59:21.999 feedback as well that could also lead us to some problems there's also the 00:59:21.999 --> 00:59:25.570 physical aspect of access ability that often gets overlooked you 00:59:25.570 --> 00:59:29.530 know somebody who might not have the ability to use a mouse or maybe they 00:59:29.530 --> 00:59:33.970 because of the mobility impairment they might have it takes them a little bit 00:59:33.970 --> 00:59:38.050 longer to interact to maybe to respond to a question for example if I'm logged 00:59:38.050 --> 00:59:42.250 into my banking site and I get a pop-up that says hey you're get you're gonna be 00:59:42.250 --> 00:59:45.610 logged out in three seconds that's probably not enough time for me to 00:59:45.610 --> 00:59:49.840 actually understand and respond to that so we take those kinds of things into 00:59:49.840 --> 00:59:54.760 account as well and closely related to that is cognitive type of disabilities 00:59:54.760 --> 00:59:59.860 and the cognitive is such a wide range of things that can come up there it's 00:59:59.860 --> 01:00:04.090 very difficult to try to cover all of that but what we can do in the web world 01:00:04.090 --> 01:00:09.910 is look at certain aspects that would fall under that cognitive nature that we 01:00:09.910 --> 01:00:14.320 can easily identify and do things with such as maybe using more simplified 01:00:14.320 --> 01:00:19.150 language or maybe ensuring that we're not referencing the left side of the 01:00:19.150 --> 01:00:22.510 screen or the right side of the screen or maybe a particular color things like 01:00:22.510 --> 01:00:25.900 that we want to make sure we're we're doing things in a way that's easy to 01:00:25.900 --> 01:00:33.730 understand by all now as far as assistive technology goes we can talk a 01:00:33.730 --> 01:00:37.480 lot about ADA law and things like that so we know in the ADA world the 01:00:37.480 --> 01:00:41.530 physical accessibility we're going to provide access to a building likely 01:00:41.530 --> 01:00:44.560 we're going to build a ramp for wheelchair users we know that it's got 01:00:44.560 --> 01:00:48.130 to be a certain width we know it's got to be within a certain tolerance as far 01:00:48.130 --> 01:00:52.360 as the slope and all that kind of stuff well it's very similar in the web world 01:00:52.360 --> 01:00:58.180 too although a little bit broader because things can be done in so many 01:00:58.180 --> 01:01:01.840 different ways so where that assistive technology comes in that's kind of like 01:01:01.840 --> 01:01:07.590 that ramp you know it kind of ties in the user being able to access the data 01:01:07.590 --> 01:01:13.900 but how we go about accommodating that through the way we code the the content 01:01:13.900 --> 01:01:17.260 that we're putting online really makes a difference because we could block the 01:01:17.260 --> 01:01:21.850 assistive technology from being able to access that so that's where WCAG and 01:01:21.850 --> 01:01:25.900 section 508 and those type of guidelines come into play as well but before we 01:01:25.900 --> 01:01:28.810 start talking too much about that we wanted to go through some of the 01:01:28.810 --> 01:01:31.840 different types of assistive technologies because one of the things 01:01:31.840 --> 01:01:36.400 we often find when we speak to individuals like yourselves is maybe 01:01:36.400 --> 01:01:40.180 you've never seen a screen reader action you know that type of thing and 01:01:40.180 --> 01:01:44.830 so that's a concept that you need to be introduced to so that you can understand 01:01:44.830 --> 01:01:48.310 it regardless of your creating content or whether you're involved in the legal 01:01:48.310 --> 01:01:52.930 aspect or the policy aspect having that knowledge helps you kind of connect 01:01:52.930 --> 01:01:57.610 those dots when people start talking about this topic so well the next series 01:01:57.610 --> 01:02:00.810 of slides here we're actually going to be showing you some examples of 01:02:00.810 --> 01:02:07.090 different types of assistive technology different types of barriers that might 01:02:07.090 --> 01:02:12.100 come up on some of these websites so that they make sense and so again if you 01:02:12.100 --> 01:02:16.060 have any questions about this feel free to stop me because it's important that 01:02:16.060 --> 01:02:22.330 you actually grasp these concepts so some types of assistive technologies 01:02:22.330 --> 01:02:25.330 that we have out there obviously screen readers that's one we hear a lot about 01:02:25.330 --> 01:02:29.440 and there's a number of different type of screen readers and they all don't 01:02:29.440 --> 01:02:33.520 work the same so just because you might have jaws that might which is a popular 01:02:33.520 --> 01:02:37.150 probably the most popular screen reader out there just because jaws might work 01:02:37.150 --> 01:02:43.090 doesn't mean that something like NVDA or window-eyes or you know Dolphin is popular 01:02:43.090 --> 01:02:46.960 in the UK it doesn't mean that it's going to work properly so we don't want 01:02:46.960 --> 01:02:51.220 to just like code to a specific assistive technology we want to make 01:02:51.220 --> 01:02:54.850 sure we're coding to the standards and and put the responsibility on those 01:02:54.850 --> 01:03:01.750 authors for the assistive technology to also abide by those standards screen 01:03:01.750 --> 01:03:05.080 magnifiers is another area that's often overlooked but it's actually quite 01:03:05.080 --> 01:03:09.280 important and but it's pretty easy to test for as well and we can talk a 01:03:09.280 --> 01:03:12.310 little bit more about screen magnification as we go but there's a lot 01:03:12.310 --> 01:03:15.040 of different makers of screen magnification out there it's also 01:03:15.040 --> 01:03:18.670 something that's built into most operating systems a voice command is 01:03:18.670 --> 01:03:22.680 another one that usually gets overlooked you might use Dragon NaturallySpeaking 01:03:22.680 --> 01:03:27.160 that's just one example of a dictation software that also gives you the ability 01:03:27.160 --> 01:03:32.950 to control your device in some way and so if you don't take that into 01:03:32.950 --> 01:03:35.950 consideration when you're creating content you could also be blocking that 01:03:35.950 --> 01:03:39.670 type of software as well and of course we have all the different built in 01:03:39.670 --> 01:03:45.160 operating system features which varies from platform to platform and if you 01:03:45.160 --> 01:03:50.320 start talking about mobile platforms you it varies from build to build quite 01:03:50.320 --> 01:03:54.820 frequently so it can get quite you know like a wild 01:03:54.820 --> 01:03:58.840 wild west out there sometimes with those things so let's get into some more of 01:03:58.840 --> 01:04:03.160 the fun stuff let's actually look at some of the demonstrations videos that 01:04:03.160 --> 01:04:06.520 we have of different type of web accessibility this is going to help us 01:04:06.520 --> 01:04:11.260 to grasp that those ideas those concepts a little better so what we have on the 01:04:11.260 --> 01:04:17.620 screen now it's a sample screenshot from a test website and basically it's a city 01:04:17.620 --> 01:04:21.850 website City Light Survey there they're providing their users a survey to answer 01:04:21.850 --> 01:04:27.070 some questions and they provide which is your favorite park and they they give 01:04:27.070 --> 01:04:32.170 you a radio button a series of radio buttons to make that selection so look 01:04:32.170 --> 01:04:35.560 at this very closely because this is kind of your cheat sheet right now 01:04:35.560 --> 01:04:38.040 because what we're going to do is we're actually going to take you to a 01:04:38.040 --> 01:04:42.400 recording of a screen reader going through this and we want to see if you 01:04:42.400 --> 01:04:45.670 can make sense of it and I can guarantee if I just go straight to the audio it's 01:04:45.670 --> 01:04:49.900 not going to make sense right so but by showing you this first it'll give you 01:04:49.900 --> 01:04:55.120 some kind of visual that you can map to and so that you can try to make line up 01:04:55.120 --> 01:04:58.960 that audio with what's happening on the screen and that's the way most screen 01:04:58.960 --> 01:05:02.710 readers somebody who's non visual do it will do it they will go through a web 01:05:02.710 --> 01:05:07.600 page using the different aspects of that web page to try to paint that picture in 01:05:07.600 --> 01:05:11.110 their head of what this content looks like what the relationship of the 01:05:11.110 --> 01:05:14.860 content is and how you know the types of controls how do I interact with it and 01:05:14.860 --> 01:05:19.990 so if you if you ever do any testing with a screen reader if you don't have 01:05:19.990 --> 01:05:22.900 that concept all you're going to be doing is listening for something to be 01:05:22.900 --> 01:05:25.690 read from the screen reader you're gonna see it on the screen and say oh it's 01:05:25.690 --> 01:05:30.190 working great but that's not usually the case let's go ahead and move over with 01:05:30.190 --> 01:05:36.010 this this image in mind let's go over and listen to this this audio of it's a 01:05:36.010 --> 01:05:42.150 jaws screen reader in this case reading through that web page city lights survey 01:05:42.150 --> 01:05:48.280 blank this week's survey : Morris City Parks national [inaudible] blank 01:05:48.280 --> 01:05:55.090 which is your favorite city park radio button object 106 radio button object 01:05:55.090 --> 01:06:00.850 206 radio button object 306 none Central Park 01:06:00.850 --> 01:06:05.920 Grand Park radio button object 406 radio button object 01:06:05.920 --> 01:06:13.650 506 radio button object 606 Jurassic Park South Park other 01:06:13.650 --> 01:06:19.839 okay so did that make sense you know some of it probably made sense because 01:06:19.839 --> 01:06:23.530 of what she saw on the screen right but when you really think about how that was 01:06:23.530 --> 01:06:28.359 read out to us trying to align those labels with the controls and it really 01:06:28.359 --> 01:06:31.599 make sense of what was being presented to us on the screen though that was 01:06:31.599 --> 01:06:35.619 almost an impossible task because it was reading the radio buttons than reading 01:06:35.619 --> 01:06:39.730 the labels you know so it wasn't linking those together too too well so that 01:06:39.730 --> 01:06:43.799 actually is a good example of labels and instructions when we talk about WCAG 01:06:43.799 --> 01:06:49.480 2 or 2.1 we'll break those down a little bit later so you have a better 01:06:49.480 --> 01:06:53.799 understanding what that structure is but ultimately we're looking at the criteria 01:06:53.799 --> 01:06:58.150 which directs us to these what's called techniques and so this happens to be 01:06:58.150 --> 01:07:02.380 fall under the success criteria they call it a three point three point two 01:07:02.380 --> 01:07:09.450 labels or instructions so this is that's the good example of a failure there 01:07:09.450 --> 01:07:18.099 that's the where we're going next city lights survey link I want to pause this 01:07:18.099 --> 01:07:22.599 just briefly um so the next screen this so that because I want to explain to you 01:07:22.599 --> 01:07:26.290 what you're going to see cuz that way it makes more sense so we heard the audio 01:07:26.290 --> 01:07:30.369 version as if we couldn't see the screen so this next video actually takes us 01:07:30.369 --> 01:07:35.230 through that same form that we saw but in this case as the screen reader is 01:07:35.230 --> 01:07:38.980 reading that's going to highlight the different sections so we're going to be 01:07:38.980 --> 01:07:43.380 able to kind of link up and be able to visually relate where these 01:07:43.380 --> 01:07:48.490 accessibility issues are and just so you know when a screen reader I think 01:07:48.490 --> 01:07:52.180 already mentioned it but when a screen reader navigates to a page they usually 01:07:52.180 --> 01:07:55.990 go through the page to try to get a visual of that there's two different 01:07:55.990 --> 01:08:00.520 modes that a screen reader user would typically take one is when they get to 01:08:00.520 --> 01:08:04.030 the page they might use their down arrow key just to kind of go through what they 01:08:04.030 --> 01:08:08.470 call the visual cursor so they may not really be physically changing the focus 01:08:08.470 --> 01:08:12.099 on the page but what they're doing is they're allowing the screen reader to go 01:08:12.099 --> 01:08:16.989 through that content and read it to them in the order not so much as its 01:08:16.989 --> 01:08:21.730 presented but in the source order under screen so if your source order is all 01:08:21.730 --> 01:08:25.990 mixed up in your visual order is a different way it's gonna be reading some 01:08:25.990 --> 01:08:30.010 weird way I don't think we're gonna see that here too much but that's that's 01:08:30.010 --> 01:08:36.010 that's generally the way a user will get their bearings on a page when they hit 01:08:36.010 --> 01:08:40.270 an input control or form type of control they often switch into what you 01:08:40.270 --> 01:08:44.620 might call a forms entry mode where the instead of using the arrow keys they 01:08:44.620 --> 01:08:49.450 might start using the tab key to tab from control to control as well and that 01:08:49.450 --> 01:08:54.010 becomes important later on I think we have an example of that but just so you 01:08:54.010 --> 01:08:57.460 know how those users typically approach it so this first one we're going to see 01:08:57.460 --> 01:09:00.670 is kind of using the arrow key method we're trying to get familiar with that 01:09:00.670 --> 01:09:05.049 form let's go ahead and watch that same form now with jaws but this time we can 01:09:05.049 --> 01:09:15.870 visually see what's going on the backwards three City Light Survey 01:09:15.870 --> 01:09:22.000 blank this week's survey : Morris City Parks National [inaudible] blank 01:09:22.000 --> 01:09:28.980 which is your favorite city park radial button object 106 radial button object 01:09:28.980 --> 01:09:33.120 206 radial button object 306 none 01:09:33.120 --> 01:09:39.609 central park Grand Park radial button object 406 radio button object 01:09:39.609 --> 01:09:48.400 506 radial button object at 606 Jurassic Park south park other so 01:09:48.400 --> 01:09:51.520 you can see the difficulty there so it was nice that it was telling how many 01:09:51.520 --> 01:09:55.210 radio buttons were part of the series so we knew how many radio buttons are how 01:09:55.210 --> 01:09:58.780 many choices whether we had to work with but those labels were not aligning at 01:09:58.780 --> 01:10:04.570 all that would be difficult to set those up so let's take you to the next screen 01:10:04.570 --> 01:10:09.640 here this is going to be the audio instead of playing that audio for you in 01:10:09.640 --> 01:10:12.730 the interest of time we're gonna go ahead and jump to the video portion so 01:10:12.730 --> 01:10:16.540 we can actually see how it was coded correctly how that should read out for 01:10:16.540 --> 01:10:22.450 us let me bypass this and now this next video will be that same audio with that 01:10:22.450 --> 01:10:28.410 form fixed properly so that it reads to the user in a way that makes sense 01:10:31.870 --> 01:10:36.860 heading level one city lights survey heading level two this week's survey colon 01:10:36.860 --> 01:10:42.170 Morris City Parks National [inaudible] blank fields are required if not 01:10:42.170 --> 01:10:48.140 otherwise noted blank favorite park blank which is your 01:10:48.140 --> 01:10:55.100 favorite city park blank radio button object none 106 blank radio button object 01:10:55.100 --> 01:11:00.440 Central Park 206 blank radio button object grant park 306 01:11:00.440 --> 01:11:05.900 blank radial button object Jurassic Park 406 blank radio button object 01:11:05.900 --> 01:11:11.200 South Park 506 blank radio button object other 606 01:11:11.200 --> 01:11:16.220 okay so did you see the difference they're a lot easier to understand I'm 01:11:16.220 --> 01:11:19.130 well a lot easier I'm not gonna say it's easier to understand if you've ever 01:11:19.130 --> 01:11:23.480 tried to use a screen reader on a web page and go through the headset that's 01:11:23.480 --> 01:11:26.390 not for the faint of heart uh-huh but it's not something you'd want 01:11:26.390 --> 01:11:30.920 to do for fun either but in this case we're able to associate those radio 01:11:30.920 --> 01:11:35.480 controls with what they were actually representing you may have also noticed 01:11:35.480 --> 01:11:39.470 something different on this form - right under the heading that says this week 01:11:39.470 --> 01:11:43.610 survey Morris city parks [inaudible] it gives us some indication about 01:11:43.610 --> 01:11:48.020 required fields now the reason I note that is because often times when we go to 01:11:48.020 --> 01:11:54.410 a forum there's some required fields but a lot of times the indication are the 01:11:54.410 --> 01:11:58.310 the notification that a certain field is required is placed at the end of the 01:11:58.310 --> 01:12:03.380 form and that's where things like understanding the virtual way the 01:12:03.380 --> 01:12:06.830 virtual cursor way of navigating with the page as opposed to when I hit those 01:12:06.830 --> 01:12:12.050 input fields I start tabbing so if you put that before you encounter those 01:12:12.050 --> 01:12:15.890 input fields the user is going to have that read to them if you put that after 01:12:15.890 --> 01:12:20.300 the fact by then they've already gone into that virtual or that tat or forms 01:12:20.300 --> 01:12:23.840 mode where they're tabbing from control to control they're gonna tab right past 01:12:23.840 --> 01:12:28.640 that type of notification and which is probably going to cause them to submit a 01:12:28.640 --> 01:12:31.700 form with errors maybe some missing fields and they're gonna have to go back 01:12:31.700 --> 01:12:35.240 in and try to figure it out and you can imagine how difficult that can be if you 01:12:35.240 --> 01:12:39.350 can't see so these these are the type of things we're looking at when it comes to 01:12:39.350 --> 01:12:43.520 creating accessible content thinking about the users and the experience that 01:12:43.520 --> 01:12:47.270 they're going to have how they interact with a page including how they 01:12:47.270 --> 01:12:50.990 do so with the assistive technologies it really is important and if you do that 01:12:50.990 --> 01:12:55.880 upfront it makes it so much easier and quicker to end up with an accessible 01:12:55.880 --> 01:13:00.410 product as opposed to as Ken mentioned late or a little while ago about being 01:13:00.410 --> 01:13:05.690 reactive so we want to be proactive in the way we approach these things so the 01:13:05.690 --> 01:13:11.540 next example has to do with images and we that's images and alt text for images 01:13:11.540 --> 01:13:15.890 is another area when you and we think of excess or somebody with disabilities we 01:13:15.890 --> 01:13:19.460 think of blind users right when we think about creating accessible content one of 01:13:19.460 --> 01:13:22.820 the first things that often comes to mind is well I got to add an alt text to 01:13:22.820 --> 01:13:26.180 my image and if you're not familiar with that what that means is when you put an 01:13:26.180 --> 01:13:30.890 image on your web page if you don't provide some type of text equivalent 01:13:30.890 --> 01:13:36.380 within the source using what's called an alt attribute it's just most likely 01:13:36.380 --> 01:13:40.850 going to read out the source of that file and sometimes those paths with the 01:13:40.850 --> 01:13:45.710 image files can be very long and cryptic and it's not a good user experience at 01:13:45.710 --> 01:13:52.400 all so in this case we're going to use these very artsy images that we have and 01:13:52.400 --> 01:13:55.670 we're going to demonstrate what it's like when a user encounters an image 01:13:55.670 --> 01:13:59.900 without alt text properly defined and then we'll show you what it looks like 01:13:59.900 --> 01:14:09.740 when it's properly defined as well let's go ahead look at the video 01:14:09.740 --> 01:14:17.340 images/G7 - makes underlined M1 graphic images / underline 01:14:17.350 --> 01:14:23.440 [inaudible] graphic so those were deliberately 01:14:23.440 --> 01:14:27.850 given very long and cryptic file names and things like that just to kind of 01:14:27.850 --> 01:14:32.530 demonstrate the point it's not always that bad that's usually it is but not 01:14:32.530 --> 01:14:35.800 always sometimes we have a filename that will actually kind of give us some kind 01:14:35.800 --> 01:14:40.060 of idea of what that image means um but in this case to the user was using the 01:14:40.060 --> 01:14:43.480 down arrow key going through the content we just happened to start after that 01:14:43.480 --> 01:14:47.410 first paragraph in the main section on that first image and so we saw that that 01:14:47.410 --> 01:14:51.910 didn't make a whole lot of sense this is one of those things when we talk about 01:14:51.910 --> 01:14:56.710 risk exposure when it comes to some of these lawsuits that have you know been 01:14:56.710 --> 01:15:00.430 on the rise and coming up this is one of those things that people will point to 01:15:00.430 --> 01:15:04.300 and say oh look because these images aren't properly tagged we're going to 01:15:04.300 --> 01:15:08.050 sue you this is also something that's really easy to identify with any 01:15:08.050 --> 01:15:11.950 scanning solution out there so these are these are things you definitely want to 01:15:11.950 --> 01:15:16.330 pay attention to because it's it's putting you at a greater risk as far as 01:15:16.330 --> 01:15:20.890 legal complaints so let's look at it the next video and this one's going to have 01:15:20.890 --> 01:15:29.920 actually have alt text properly applied to those images 01:15:29.920 --> 01:15:36.460 A stick man standing upright graphic a stick man doing a handstand graphic it made much more 01:15:36.460 --> 01:15:40.150 sense didn't it now in the context of this test page you probably would 01:15:40.150 --> 01:15:44.440 probably be considered decorative images which is a whole different thing but for 01:15:44.440 --> 01:15:47.739 the purpose of demonstration we wanted to show you the difference between what 01:15:47.739 --> 01:15:52.210 it sounds like without the alt text with the proper alt text and again this is a 01:15:52.210 --> 01:15:56.230 high risk area on your web pages especially if you're providing images 01:15:56.230 --> 01:16:00.670 that have meaning and conveying some type of information you definitely want 01:16:00.670 --> 01:16:06.610 to make sure they're properly tagged with that alt text attribute now this 01:16:06.610 --> 01:16:09.550 next thing we want to show you is something that all too often gets 01:16:09.550 --> 01:16:15.250 overlooked so a lot of organizations like yours might start using some type 01:16:15.250 --> 01:16:19.780 of accessibility scanner whether it's a free one whether it's a a commercial one 01:16:19.780 --> 01:16:24.670 you know I know that talking to Ryan I think you all have started might start 01:16:24.670 --> 01:16:28.390 using one of our competitors soon and that's fine because all tools out there 01:16:28.390 --> 01:16:32.440 have some benefits to them it really comes down to how you intend to use 01:16:32.440 --> 01:16:35.170 those and what you're going to need in the future we can talk about that a 01:16:35.170 --> 01:16:40.210 little bit later but one of the things that all these tools fail to do is to 01:16:40.210 --> 01:16:44.110 check for everything it's only a small portion that these scanning tools can 01:16:44.110 --> 01:16:48.219 ever really validate for but what you might hear from a lot of salespeople is 01:16:48.219 --> 01:16:51.940 hey use this tool will catch everything for you will solve all all your worlds 01:16:51.940 --> 01:16:57.370 problems right but that's just not the case there is a level of manual what we 01:16:57.370 --> 01:17:01.510 call testing that goes into validating the accessibility of these webpages and 01:17:01.510 --> 01:17:06.370 this is a good example of that so one of the things the automated scanners won't 01:17:06.370 --> 01:17:10.960 do is really identify or validate whether or not you're providing the 01:17:10.960 --> 01:17:16.120 proper visual indication of focus and that may not seem like a big deal but 01:17:16.120 --> 01:17:19.330 remember that there's a lot of people out there that can't use a mouse and 01:17:19.330 --> 01:17:24.010 they rely on that keyboard and so when they're using just the keyboard to tab 01:17:24.010 --> 01:17:29.380 through a website they have to know where that current focus is not only is 01:17:29.380 --> 01:17:32.170 that important for the keyboard only user but a lot of the assistive 01:17:32.170 --> 01:17:36.699 technologies that are in use out there rely on that keyboard accessibility as a 01:17:36.699 --> 01:17:41.530 base to build upon so that keyboard accessibility is lacking in any way it 01:17:41.530 --> 01:17:44.739 could also interfere with some of that assistive technology from working 01:17:44.739 --> 01:17:48.489 properly as well and this is something that anybody can test for you don't have 01:17:48.489 --> 01:17:52.929 to be technical or anything like that to do keyboard testing in this way so what 01:17:52.929 --> 01:17:58.059 we're going to show you is in this next video is an example of not providing the 01:17:58.059 --> 01:18:00.880 proper visual focus and then we'll show you what it looks like when you actually 01:18:00.880 --> 01:18:05.639 provide the focus and a proper way again this is tabbing through a website 01:18:05.639 --> 01:18:13.420 using just the keyboard not using a mouse we're going to demonstrate a 01:18:13.420 --> 01:18:18.639 failure of success criteria 2.4.7 and what we're going to 01:18:18.639 --> 01:18:23.349 focus on is the top level navigation of this page if you look at the top of the 01:18:23.349 --> 01:18:29.760 page you'll Lucian's product blog out link notice that with the mouse cursor 01:18:29.760 --> 01:18:37.380 you have a hover effect tab into this 01:18:37.769 --> 01:18:45.929 Lucian's has focused now product has tab one more time there's blog 01:18:52.050 --> 01:18:56.429 so and and you could experience that almost with almost any webpage but a 01:18:56.429 --> 01:18:59.309 lot of web pages out there you'll experience that if you go to them and 01:18:59.309 --> 01:19:03.570 try to tab through them so let's see what that should look like if we're you 01:19:03.570 --> 01:19:10.320 providing the proper accommodations for that keyboard focus this is to 01:19:10.320 --> 01:19:15.630 demonstrate a successful implementation of criteria 2.4.7 01:19:15.630 --> 01:19:21.030 focus visible and on this page we have some top navigation links and that will 01:19:21.030 --> 01:19:25.559 receive keyboard focus as we hover over these with the mouse cursor you will see 01:19:25.559 --> 01:19:31.889 that there is some type of Earth visual and patient feedback that before that 01:19:31.889 --> 01:19:40.260 mouse cursor is something very similar when were only the keyboard what we're 01:19:40.260 --> 01:19:45.030 going to do is tab into this page using the keyboard into those links be that 01:19:45.030 --> 01:19:50.309 same type of visual indication of focus but hidden hit tab once the solutions 01:19:50.309 --> 01:19:56.510 link now has focus and we see that visual indicator that it does have a 01:19:56.690 --> 01:20:03.239 product begin blog and tab one more time to about and all four of those links now 01:20:03.239 --> 01:20:10.409 have a visual indication of focus that would be a successful implementation of 01:20:10.409 --> 01:20:17.699 criteria so that's pretty simple and most of the stuff honestly when it comes 01:20:17.699 --> 01:20:22.079 to accessibility generally is pretty simple if we take it into account at 01:20:22.079 --> 01:20:26.010 design time you know when we have to go back and fix it after the fact that's 01:20:26.010 --> 01:20:31.440 when it can be timely and costly and kind of a headache to fix so I just want 01:20:31.440 --> 01:20:34.440 to make sure you were able to see that now I don't think we have time an hour 01:20:34.440 --> 01:20:37.619 do we have a video in the past what we do is we'd actually kind of broadcast 01:20:37.619 --> 01:20:42.119 the phone an actual mobile device over the screen but we're not set up to do 01:20:42.119 --> 01:20:46.320 that today just to show you how you would interact with a mobile device it's 01:20:46.320 --> 01:20:51.630 very similar in this case we are actually showing how when using this as 01:20:51.630 --> 01:20:56.040 an iOS device when you use the voiceover was a demonstration of how the menu 01:20:56.040 --> 01:20:59.130 items in the hamburger menu which is those three little bars in the upper 01:20:59.130 --> 01:21:03.300 right hand side looks like a hamburger if you select that it would display the 01:21:03.300 --> 01:21:09.060 the drop menu or the little flyout mean he'll the choices for that site using 01:21:09.060 --> 01:21:13.050 voiceover in this particular instance that hamburger menu is read last 01:21:13.050 --> 01:21:17.730 basically you're informed that it's a menu and all the menu items in the menu 01:21:17.730 --> 01:21:21.780 are read before that but they're never displayed on the screen may not may seem 01:21:21.780 --> 01:21:25.410 like a big deal for somebody who's blind completely blind but there's a lot of 01:21:25.410 --> 01:21:29.670 folks out there who have just slight visual impairments that still rely on 01:21:29.670 --> 01:21:33.990 the audio feedback so in that case it would be a problem so that's what that 01:21:33.990 --> 01:21:37.590 particular demonstration was if you want to see that I'll be happy to show that 01:21:37.590 --> 01:21:41.370 to you after you know if you want to come up and show it to your head on the 01:21:41.370 --> 01:21:46.500 phone but that's a another area we have to keep in mind when it comes to those 01:21:46.500 --> 01:21:53.610 things voiceover on Safari reader button shows or hides 01:21:53.610 --> 01:22:03.810 Safari reader address compliance assurance.com double tap to show 01:22:03.810 --> 01:22:17.670 controls reload button compliance by Cyxtera homepage visited link banner 01:22:17.670 --> 01:22:29.320 landmark solutions visited link product visited link It's accessing those menu items that are not 01:22:29.320 --> 01:22:37.870 displayed at this time blog link about link the next one should tell you it's 01:22:37.870 --> 01:22:48.880 actually the menu test your site now link next one mobile menu visited link end banner link 01:22:48.880 --> 01:22:54.460 to display menu for mobile devices okay so that's a little bit of out of order we're gonna 01:22:54.460 --> 01:22:58.210 go ahead and jump past that a little bit of out of order just to demonstrate that 01:22:58.210 --> 01:23:02.770 but what that really demonstrates for us though is not only the fact that just 01:23:02.770 --> 01:23:06.550 because we have some a web presence on the desktop we have to think about that 01:23:06.550 --> 01:23:10.090 but we also have to think about the other ways that people access our 01:23:10.090 --> 01:23:14.200 websites on mobile devices and things in this case that was what you'd call a 01:23:14.200 --> 01:23:19.060 responsive design site meaning that as you got on the smaller screen it's the 01:23:19.060 --> 01:23:23.290 same content but you're using different styling to present that into a smaller 01:23:23.290 --> 01:23:27.220 form factor but if you're not taking into account accessibility the desktop 01:23:27.220 --> 01:23:32.860 site might seem to work fine but your mobile smaller viewport may be 01:23:32.860 --> 01:23:37.270 totally busted so again there's a lot we have to look at and think about now when 01:23:37.270 --> 01:23:41.740 it comes to WCAG we'll just briefly go over this because I know we have 01:23:41.740 --> 01:23:45.430 another thing another topic to go through pretty quick is WCAG Kim 01:23:45.430 --> 01:23:48.880 mentioned what that is it's a set of guidelines but really the way WCAG 01:23:48.880 --> 01:23:52.780 is is laid out is really where people get confused so it starts out with four 01:23:52.780 --> 01:23:57.880 principles that being perceivable operable understandable and robust okay 01:23:57.880 --> 01:24:01.450 great that's your top level principles then it goes down into these twelve 01:24:01.450 --> 01:24:07.690 guidelines now this is 2.0 this isn't 2.1 2.1 goes from 12 guidelines to 13 01:24:07.690 --> 01:24:11.920 guidelines but we don't need to get into that just yet but where you really need 01:24:11.920 --> 01:24:17.200 to pay attention when it comes to WCAG is the success criteria that's what 01:24:17.200 --> 01:24:20.920 you have to conform with if you're going to ever make the statement that we 01:24:20.920 --> 01:24:26.290 comply or we conform with WCAG 2.0 or 2.1 it's the success criterion and what 01:24:26.290 --> 01:24:29.619 those are those are basically statements that you 01:24:29.619 --> 01:24:35.229 can take as being true or false and then you can use different rules to kind of 01:24:35.229 --> 01:24:41.260 evaluate that the other thing that WCAG provides for us is called techniques 01:24:41.260 --> 01:24:45.819 efficient techniques advisory techniques failure techniques and what these are 01:24:45.819 --> 01:24:49.959 these are kind of testable steps for example go to the webpage if any images 01:24:49.959 --> 01:24:55.209 exist validate that they have proper alt text attributes right so there's there 01:24:55.209 --> 01:24:58.299 are some steps you could take the validate whether or not you're meeting 01:24:58.299 --> 01:25:03.609 that particular success criterion the thing to remember about that is there's 01:25:03.609 --> 01:25:07.809 a lot of different ways to accomplish the same thing so just because one 01:25:07.809 --> 01:25:13.030 success criterion wasn't used to create accessible content and I should say 01:25:13.030 --> 01:25:17.679 technique another technique may actually bring you into compliance with that 01:25:17.679 --> 01:25:22.419 criterion that's important especially if you're using a scanning solution because 01:25:22.419 --> 01:25:26.079 scanning solutions are looking for these rules that are based on the techniques 01:25:26.079 --> 01:25:30.189 so you could have a website that is a hundred percent compliant or accessible 01:25:30.189 --> 01:25:34.179 and then when you run a scanning solution against it you could get a 01:25:34.179 --> 01:25:38.199 dozen errors failures that come up and say this page isn't working right that's 01:25:38.199 --> 01:25:42.519 just you know it's just not true it really depends on what that tool is 01:25:42.519 --> 01:25:48.579 looking for as far as validating that content and so when you start using a 01:25:48.579 --> 01:25:51.159 scanning solution that's one of the things we want you to be aware of is 01:25:51.159 --> 01:25:54.699 just because it's coming up and showing you failures you have to take the time 01:25:54.699 --> 01:25:58.209 to actually go look at that failure and understand why is it flagging this as a 01:25:58.209 --> 01:26:00.639 failure and does that failure really matter 01:26:00.639 --> 01:26:04.510 is it really preventing me from being accessible in conforming with these 01:26:04.510 --> 01:26:08.199 standards and that's something that is often overlooked and never shared by a 01:26:08.199 --> 01:26:15.659 sales guy that's trying to sell you a scanning solution oh just before warned 01:26:15.959 --> 01:26:19.510 so there we go that's that's the error we have to conform with not the 01:26:19.510 --> 01:26:24.849 technique techniques are great for guidance but that's the criteria and so 01:26:24.849 --> 01:26:29.919 just to kind of again break it down to point one gives us those from 13 01:26:29.919 --> 01:26:34.359 guidelines to 78 different success criteria so it's a little bit more and 01:26:34.359 --> 01:26:39.969 we're broken down into A double A triple A for some of those Triple A you're 01:26:39.969 --> 01:26:43.750 probably never going to happen worried about even the W3C who maintains 01:26:43.750 --> 01:26:47.740 the set of guidelines says if you can do triple A great but it's probably not 01:26:47.740 --> 01:26:51.250 really reasonable because of the amount of effort that has to go into that so 01:26:51.250 --> 01:26:55.360 they recommend shooting for a first and then double a so if you can get double A 01:26:55.360 --> 01:27:01.630 then you're doing pretty well here are some links that can take you into those 01:27:01.630 --> 01:27:05.290 if you've not familiar with WCAG or if you actually will you know looking 01:27:05.290 --> 01:27:09.880 for some non interesting reading these are where you go but these these links 01:27:09.880 --> 01:27:13.480 will actually give you a good overview especially that last one it kind of 01:27:13.480 --> 01:27:17.530 breaks it out a little bit the overview or the section on how you 01:27:17.530 --> 01:27:21.030 can do it even gives you the ability to kind of filter down to the type of 01:27:21.030 --> 01:27:25.870 content you're working with whether it's HTML PDF things like that so it's it's 01:27:25.870 --> 01:27:34.270 good good for that that that brings that section to an end is it got a couple of 01:27:34.270 --> 01:27:42.400 questions perfect so let's go ahead and take those questions questions first I 01:27:42.400 --> 01:27:47.170 think sorry I meant to talk to you before but we're going through that 01:27:47.170 --> 01:27:53.950 first video mm-hmm with jaws it was reading blank right now Sunny's asking if 01:27:53.950 --> 01:27:59.770 that was because there's a paragraph or a break tag yeah generally it's because 01:27:59.770 --> 01:28:04.330 it's either an empty paragraph tag that parent you know and tags with no no 01:28:04.330 --> 01:28:08.590 content are break the jaws will do that not all screen readers will do that but 01:28:08.590 --> 01:28:13.560 jaws will definitely read those blanks 01:28:13.560 --> 01:28:20.520 next question is at what point do we legally a standard based on literal 01:28:20.520 --> 01:28:26.260 requirements versus best practices due to issues between various software such 01:28:26.260 --> 01:28:32.350 as jaws versus voiceover vs. yeah it's a good question can can correct me if I'm 01:28:32.350 --> 01:28:36.280 wrong but again we mentioned about the criteria as opposed to the technique so 01:28:36.280 --> 01:28:40.450 we always want to take into account the criteria if we're abiding by that 01:28:40.450 --> 01:28:45.910 criteria even of an assistive technology like jaws may not read it correctly but 01:28:45.910 --> 01:28:49.990 we know that other assistive technology is reading it well then most likely it's 01:28:49.990 --> 01:28:53.860 that assistive technology itself that isn't really abiding by those guidelines 01:28:53.860 --> 01:28:58.479 so we do not want to code to a specific assistive technology 01:28:58.479 --> 01:29:02.289 unless we have a really absolute valid reason for doing so like all our 01:29:02.289 --> 01:29:06.010 students are going to be using jaws and accessing via that that's a different 01:29:06.010 --> 01:29:09.489 thing but if you're looking to conform we want to focus on what the standards 01:29:09.489 --> 01:29:13.389 say and again you have the techniques that will help you to get there but it's 01:29:13.389 --> 01:29:17.590 that criteria that success criteria that we have to conform with hopefully that 01:29:17.590 --> 01:29:20.460 answers the question 01:29:22.329 --> 01:29:26.710 scanning solutions can stumble and sometimes give false positives or false 01:29:26.710 --> 01:29:32.110 negatives how much of the legal compliance standard is based on such 01:29:32.110 --> 01:29:38.710 scanners versus well actually it's correct but the scanners family yeah so 01:29:38.710 --> 01:29:42.519 I mean that's it's actually a big issue in my opinion because even some of our 01:29:42.519 --> 01:29:47.829 customers we do work for and they might provide solutions to different higher ed 01:29:47.829 --> 01:29:52.269 campuses and often times they'll come back to us and they'll say this campus 01:29:52.269 --> 01:29:56.050 just sent us this scan with this tool and have all has all these failures and 01:29:56.050 --> 01:29:59.199 they're now they're up in arms and they're upset and what we'll do is we 01:29:59.199 --> 01:30:02.380 have to actually go in there and show them yeah the scanning solution is 01:30:02.380 --> 01:30:05.199 finding all these failures or false positives and sometimes they're not even 01:30:05.199 --> 01:30:09.699 false positive sometimes they're actually real failures but it's like 01:30:09.699 --> 01:30:14.110 code fragments that are never even displayed to the user and never even 01:30:14.110 --> 01:30:19.329 encountered by the assistive technology so really what we try to do is more 01:30:19.329 --> 01:30:25.179 focus on is the page accessible and then are we meeting with those guidelines but 01:30:25.179 --> 01:30:29.079 we do have some customers that have agreed to some kind of legal settlement 01:30:29.079 --> 01:30:33.429 where they've in my opinion again foolishly have said we're going to 01:30:33.429 --> 01:30:38.349 completely comply with WCAG 2.0 level a it's like well that's kind of an 01:30:38.349 --> 01:30:42.610 impossible task when you really come down to it because now you have to go in 01:30:42.610 --> 01:30:45.519 and clean up all your code to make sure all these different false positives are 01:30:45.519 --> 01:30:49.389 gone and all that kind of stuff so yeah scanning solutions will generate a lot 01:30:49.389 --> 01:30:54.070 of false positives but again understand what it's looking for and what the real 01:30:54.070 --> 01:31:00.789 implication is of those one more question how can we honestly and 01:31:00.789 --> 01:31:05.619 appropriately address Hawaiian language issues which aren't supported by screen 01:31:05.619 --> 01:31:11.199 screen readers so we have lot of web pages I have mixed English 01:31:11.199 --> 01:31:18.579 Hawaiian words though I guess how can we so basically what if I understand the 01:31:18.579 --> 01:31:22.360 question right is the screen readers are not reading the Hawaiian words with the 01:31:22.360 --> 01:31:25.229 right pronunciation 01:31:30.119 --> 01:31:33.119 uh-huh 01:31:38.570 --> 01:31:43.070 no no you I understand most screen readers like 01:31:43.070 --> 01:31:46.909 jaws the the higher end ones do have a support for a number of different 01:31:46.909 --> 01:31:50.000 languages unfortunately they probably don't have support for the Hawaiian 01:31:50.000 --> 01:31:55.460 language I would guess but if you want to comply so there's two different 01:31:55.460 --> 01:32:00.139 approaches of that right do am i looking to comply as opposed am i looking to 01:32:00.139 --> 01:32:05.150 make sure this is accessible as possible if I'm looking to comply you would you 01:32:05.150 --> 01:32:10.969 would check to see is there a language tag that is close to his Hawaiian as it 01:32:10.969 --> 01:32:15.500 can be and use that for those sections of content that are actually in the 01:32:15.500 --> 01:32:18.650 Hawaiian language like maybe there's a Polynesian one I don't know because I 01:32:18.650 --> 01:32:23.480 haven't looked right but if you can find one that's close it might help the 01:32:23.480 --> 01:32:31.520 another way you could do that it's kind of a hack and I don't recommend you do 01:32:31.520 --> 01:32:35.300 it but sometimes the way you can do that is where you're using certain Hawaiian 01:32:35.300 --> 01:32:39.110 words or something like that you could actually use an image of text and then 01:32:39.110 --> 01:32:44.389 as part of the alt text phonetically spell that out so that the screen reader 01:32:44.389 --> 01:32:48.260 will try to pronounce it as closely as possible but that's a lot of work to do 01:32:48.260 --> 01:32:53.900 but if it's absolutely necessary I mean you could try that but would you 01:32:53.900 --> 01:33:02.960 disagree with that candidate that's kind of a that would be kind of a challenging 01:33:02.960 --> 01:33:07.969 one but if it's absolutely necessary that's one approach is just to make it 01:33:07.969 --> 01:33:12.020 an image of text and then try to phonetically match that so that the 01:33:12.020 --> 01:33:17.690 screen reader can get as close as possible this is Sunny I was the one 01:33:17.690 --> 01:33:23.929 that was asking that question I'm in Hilo we have entire web pages that are 01:33:23.929 --> 01:33:33.380 Hawaiian and it's inappropriate or not to the context of the page to put that 01:33:33.380 --> 01:33:39.230 page to translate that page into English it's in Hawaiian it's for Hawaiian 01:33:39.230 --> 01:33:46.460 coursework but screen reader technology jus t doesn't support Hawaiian so at what 01:33:46.460 --> 01:33:52.130 point do we consider ourselves compliant because the lets pretend all the markup 01:33:52.130 --> 01:33:56.760 and everything is compliant but it's a failing of the technology 01:33:56.760 --> 01:34:03.900 that Hawaiian isn't supported so are we considered compliant in that case yes so 01:34:03.900 --> 01:34:07.980 if you're using all the other markup that that's outlined there than you and 01:34:07.980 --> 01:34:11.370 you're using the technology that's available you would still in my opinion 01:34:11.370 --> 01:34:15.150 you'd be considered compliant the other thing you have to look at too is well 01:34:15.150 --> 01:34:20.040 just how many blind users you know that are using a screen reader would need 01:34:20.040 --> 01:34:24.060 that accommodation if you don't have any that it's kind of not really something 01:34:24.060 --> 01:34:27.000 you have to worry about if you do have it that's a different thing but the 01:34:27.000 --> 01:34:29.670 challenge there is is they're not going to get that anyways if the screen 01:34:29.670 --> 01:34:40.860 readers don't support it I mean even if you don't know that someone will need it 01:34:40.860 --> 01:34:46.020 like right there could be someone right but if the assistive technology is 01:34:46.020 --> 01:34:50.969 doesn't support that level of access then the next thing you could do is is 01:34:50.969 --> 01:34:56.250 reach out to people like Freedom Scientific who create those you know 01:34:56.250 --> 01:34:59.070 things like the screen reader jaws screen reader and ask them if they could 01:34:59.070 --> 01:35:02.670 provide that kind of support I mean that's that's one approach 01:35:02.670 --> 01:35:07.620 at least then you're you're proactively trying to engage with those suppliers to 01:35:07.620 --> 01:35:10.770 see if they're they'll help accommodate that so otherwise you're kind of blocked 01:35:10.770 --> 01:35:14.630 unless you write your own screen reader you know in that particular situation 01:35:14.630 --> 01:35:29.969 but is limited you know in certain ways did you have a question ma'am? I was wondering for effective 01:35:29.969 --> 01:35:34.560 communication that's where are on the website we could write if because of the 01:35:34.560 --> 01:35:38.820 screen reader not be able to read Hawaiian or another language I mean you 01:35:38.820 --> 01:35:47.750 could say that you we could call and you have it read to you or come to the office if that's accessible to you yeah 01:35:49.010 --> 01:35:53.010 exactly those are good options as a matter of fact you could actually maybe 01:35:53.010 --> 01:35:57.360 provide a link to an audio file of somebody reading that you know in the 01:35:57.360 --> 01:36:01.650 right way and that would be providing you know some type of accommodation that 01:36:01.650 --> 01:36:06.060 would work as well so just because you might not have a specific technique in 01:36:06.060 --> 01:36:10.080 the guidelines that says you have to do this way they're written in such a way 01:36:10.080 --> 01:37:23.370 that you can very imaginative and solve things in different ways [inaudible] that's a good question and that really 01:37:23.370 --> 01:37:27.420 comes down to you know it's kind of a choice you have to make as you go just 01:37:27.420 --> 01:37:32.760 how important is it that that user get that information off the website or you 01:37:32.760 --> 01:37:38.400 know for example yeah and just how much time and effort and even cost is it 01:37:38.400 --> 01:37:44.250 going to take to make that as accessible as possible so there's a that's kind of 01:37:44.250 --> 01:37:49.950 a going to be vary from organization organization and person to person but 01:37:49.950 --> 01:37:53.730 again you can look at different ways to like say you have a big infographic 01:37:53.730 --> 01:37:57.180 there's a lot of different ways you could tackle that but you could you 01:37:57.180 --> 01:38:01.260 could record an audio description of it and provide a link to that audio file 01:38:01.260 --> 01:38:05.070 that's one way to do it probably one of the cheapest and easier ways you just 01:38:05.070 --> 01:38:09.020 have to make sure whatever you're providing as a description is accurate 01:38:09.020 --> 01:38:13.230 so there's a lot of different ways to do it but as far as when do you make the call 01:38:13.230 --> 01:38:18.840 it really comes down to what's the for me it's how much benefit is the users 01:38:18.840 --> 01:38:24.450 going to have compared to the time and investment that I'm making if it if the return on 01:38:24.450 --> 01:38:29.220 investment is very small then you probably want to take the less intensive 01:38:29.220 --> 01:38:42.119 approach as long as you're providing some means for it so that's 01:38:42.119 --> 01:38:48.300 I think that's going to be on a person-by-person level but yeah when you 01:38:48.300 --> 01:38:51.840 try though it's probably going to be more frustrating for the majority of 01:38:51.840 --> 01:38:56.099 users if you try to mark everything up on the page and it doesn't really come 01:38:56.099 --> 01:39:00.030 out in the right order or makes sense right and you can spend a lot of time 01:39:00.030 --> 01:39:03.900 doing that and that's why you might want to maybe even consider using like a long 01:39:03.900 --> 01:39:07.020 description that takes you to a different page with just text that 01:39:07.020 --> 01:39:12.360 describes that or again an audio file or even the ability for them to call up 01:39:12.360 --> 01:39:15.810 and have somebody explain that to them there's a lot of different ways to do it 01:39:15.810 --> 01:39:19.230 and as far as what's more frustrating that's going to again that's just going 01:39:19.230 --> 01:39:23.150 to vary on the on the user preference 01:39:27.619 --> 01:39:37.320 okay question came in from Sunny under our GRA deadlines we are are we going 01:39:37.320 --> 01:39:41.730 you need to take the nuclear option they're telling content providers that 01:39:41.730 --> 01:39:46.110 aren't going to meet the deadlines that for that where we are removing their 01:39:46.110 --> 01:39:52.530 content for non-compliance that's more of a Ken Nakata a question I believe so I'll 01:39:52.530 --> 01:40:06.630 defer to Ken okay yeah unfortunately if you agreed that you make you agreed 01:40:06.630 --> 01:40:14.520 under a VR8 to comply with WCAG 2.0 the double A universally then yeah 01:40:14.520 --> 01:40:23.940 you may end up telling content you're gonna oh but I should mention that's for 01:40:23.940 --> 01:40:30.239 you and your legal counsel to talk about I'm not your lawyer so that that's what 01:40:30.239 --> 01:40:38.580 that's just my answer don't take it to the bank we got some guidance from the 01:40:38.580 --> 01:40:46.730 system on that thank you - any other questions 01:40:46.730 --> 01:40:50.880 so Ken we don't whole lot of times you want me to breeze 01:40:50.880 --> 01:40:55.200 through this last one or yeah okay so this we're gonna go ahead and jump into 01:40:55.200 --> 01:41:00.540 the last presentation we had this one is actually came about because we we often 01:41:00.540 --> 01:41:04.560 attend different disability conferences throughout the year one of the largest 01:41:04.560 --> 01:41:09.840 is CSUN the California State University of North Ridge dissenter on disabilities 01:41:09.840 --> 01:41:13.710 user with disabilities conference it's an international conference that's held 01:41:13.710 --> 01:41:17.070 every year is probably the largest in the world and that's where we first 01:41:17.070 --> 01:41:22.310 started to recognize that when an organization whether public or private 01:41:22.310 --> 01:41:26.460 decided that they had to do something about accessibility they would pick 01:41:26.460 --> 01:41:30.120 somebody within the organization usually a single person and say hey we need to 01:41:30.120 --> 01:41:33.390 make our stuff accessible we're gonna send you to this conference to go learn 01:41:33.390 --> 01:41:37.170 about how to do it and so that person would come to these conferences and 01:41:37.170 --> 01:41:41.040 there they would just be overwhelmed because most of those sessions and 01:41:41.040 --> 01:41:44.610 lectures that go on at the conference's are usually pretty specific they're 01:41:44.610 --> 01:41:47.850 talking about certain things are they're pushing a product or things like that 01:41:47.850 --> 01:41:51.870 there's so much information that you'd literally see some of these folks at the 01:41:51.870 --> 01:41:54.690 end of the week and their eyes would just be spinning around in their head 01:41:54.690 --> 01:41:58.230 and they had more questions now than then they when they did when they 01:41:58.230 --> 01:42:03.780 arrived and no answers and so after seeing that and talking to people that 01:42:03.780 --> 01:42:07.530 were experiencing that frustration we thought what do we really need we need a 01:42:07.530 --> 01:42:12.930 presentation that will help somebody create a plan something that they can 01:42:12.930 --> 01:42:16.770 take back to their organization and say okay accessibility is an important thing 01:42:16.770 --> 01:42:21.150 but how do we go about implementing it as quickly as possible with the least 01:42:21.150 --> 01:42:25.680 amount of effort in cost so at least we can get something going and have some 01:42:25.680 --> 01:42:31.110 kind of approach that's going to actually lead to success as opposed to 01:42:31.110 --> 01:42:34.650 oh we're going to buy a screen reader and try to test your own pages or buy a 01:42:34.650 --> 01:42:38.310 scanner only realize that we get a bunch of false positives and then give up 01:42:38.310 --> 01:42:43.670 right until we get sued so that's what this four-step model for avoiding web 01:42:43.670 --> 01:42:48.540 accessibility liability really is it's kind of helps you to outline how do we 01:42:48.540 --> 01:42:52.770 approach this and from what I understand you all are kind of starting down this 01:42:52.770 --> 01:42:57.000 now for the first time so this might be a really good just quick overview of how 01:42:57.000 --> 01:43:01.110 do I go about making sure something's accessible so that it makes sense not 01:43:01.110 --> 01:43:05.100 only to me but to others as well so we're gonna jump past a few of these 01:43:05.100 --> 01:43:10.739 um one of the most important things as far as protecting yourself from well 01:43:10.739 --> 01:43:14.900 litigation is having some type of accessibility statement and that 01:43:14.900 --> 01:43:18.810 accessibility statement you have to be careful in what you say about it did you 01:43:18.810 --> 01:43:22.710 want to talk about that or do we just okay so I don't know about get all this 01:43:22.710 --> 01:43:25.890 right because I don't normally deal with the accessibility statement side of it 01:43:25.890 --> 01:43:29.429 but basically all that statement is it's that sort of like a privacy statement 01:43:29.429 --> 01:43:32.400 but what you're doing is you're stating your intent 01:43:32.400 --> 01:43:37.710 you're not saying hey we're going to be our we're not saying we are compliant 01:43:37.710 --> 01:43:42.300 100% with wick egg you know level double-a because that's in a sense is 01:43:42.300 --> 01:43:46.110 like putting a target on yourself because somebody's gonna look at that 01:43:46.110 --> 01:43:49.500 and say oh I'm gonna go prove you wrong because you just claimed that you are 01:43:49.500 --> 01:43:54.840 right well instead you you kind of state your intent that we strive to be meet 01:43:54.840 --> 01:43:59.100 these guidelines so it's showing that hey I'm doing the best I can and and I 01:43:59.100 --> 01:44:03.090 have the right attitude or the right motive in doing so the other thing you 01:44:03.090 --> 01:44:08.640 want to include in your accessibility statement is contact information before 01:44:08.640 --> 01:44:14.250 slate sorry there we go you set forth your policy but you want 01:44:14.250 --> 01:44:17.760 to have your contact information as well the key about that contact information 01:44:17.760 --> 01:44:22.380 is it gives somebody that might be experiencing some problems as far as 01:44:22.380 --> 01:44:27.000 accessing the content a way to get help whether it be through an email address a 01:44:27.000 --> 01:44:31.469 phone call or whatever the trick with that is is when you whatever you 01:44:31.469 --> 01:44:35.640 approach you take is if somebody calls you and leaves a message or if somebody 01:44:35.640 --> 01:44:39.030 sends you an email you need to respond within a certain amount of time because 01:44:39.030 --> 01:44:42.929 we've had a lot of folks that we know that set up this kind of thing and 01:44:42.929 --> 01:44:46.710 somebody calls and they never get a return call back right well that's 01:44:46.710 --> 01:44:50.699 that's kind of more of an insult and it kind of makes people upset so they're 01:44:50.699 --> 01:44:54.239 more likely to have a legal complaint against you that your accessibility 01:44:54.239 --> 01:44:59.310 statement wants to include that as well another nice thing to incorporate is 01:44:59.310 --> 01:45:04.110 some kind of feedback mechanism so if somebody is having an issue or maybe 01:45:04.110 --> 01:45:08.969 they have a recommendation on what you can do better then it empowers the user 01:45:08.969 --> 01:45:13.590 to give you some kind of guidance as well and then and and it makes them feel 01:45:13.590 --> 01:45:17.280 okay you do care and you're going to listen to me 01:45:17.280 --> 01:45:20.760 and so it's nice also to be able to respond to that feedback not just let it 01:45:20.760 --> 01:45:25.140 go off into a black hole and they never hear anything that's an accessibility 01:45:25.140 --> 01:45:28.650 statement an accessibility statement will save you a lot of trouble because 01:45:28.650 --> 01:45:33.570 if I'm out there going from website to website looking for somebody to sue and 01:45:33.570 --> 01:45:38.100 I come across an accessibility statement that's structured that way my case is a 01:45:38.100 --> 01:45:42.000 lot less stronger if I'm going to try to pursue a legal complaint so I'm probably 01:45:42.000 --> 01:45:46.020 going to go to the easier targets again you can reduce your risk window just 01:45:46.020 --> 01:45:49.110 with that accessibility statement so that's one of the first things you want 01:45:49.110 --> 01:45:55.050 to look at is this slide just kind of covers what we were talking about now 01:45:55.050 --> 01:46:00.390 the next part is actually thinking about how do we go about validating our site 01:46:00.390 --> 01:46:05.160 to make sure it's accessible - first of all to see where do we stand as far as 01:46:05.160 --> 01:46:09.690 how accessible we are and you get an understanding of what we have to do to 01:46:09.690 --> 01:46:14.100 make it better and get to an accessible accessible state so one of the things 01:46:14.100 --> 01:46:17.520 you want to do is we talked about earlier is making sure that manual 01:46:17.520 --> 01:46:23.220 testing is involved but the way you approach this really makes a difference 01:46:23.220 --> 01:46:28.110 on how much work it is so the title of this slide is manual testing and key use 01:46:28.110 --> 01:46:32.970 of cases and templates so we're going to talk about what all that means so one of 01:46:32.970 --> 01:46:36.030 the first things you want to do before you start looking at your site for is 01:46:36.030 --> 01:46:39.870 for accessibility is have some kind of plan so you want to ask yourself why do 01:46:39.870 --> 01:46:44.010 people go to my site what's the purpose for this page because whatever that 01:46:44.010 --> 01:46:49.140 primary purpose is that a person is coming to the site for that is what has 01:46:49.140 --> 01:46:54.030 to be accessible you can have inaccessible content on the site but as 01:46:54.030 --> 01:46:58.890 long as that primary task is fully accessible your again you're reducing 01:46:58.890 --> 01:47:02.610 the complaints and the risk it's not that you want to leave it that way but 01:47:02.610 --> 01:47:05.730 you want to make sure that they're able to accomplish what they came to your 01:47:05.730 --> 01:47:10.950 site to do the other thing you want to do is identify your most visited pages 01:47:10.950 --> 01:47:14.520 and the reason that is is because as a user comes into a website there's a 01:47:14.520 --> 01:47:17.970 number of pages that they usually end up done you know and you can get that 01:47:17.970 --> 01:47:21.360 through your web analytics and if you want that information because you want 01:47:21.360 --> 01:47:25.290 those site those people those particular pages to be as strong as possible 01:47:25.290 --> 01:47:29.480 because now you're creating this 01:47:29.970 --> 01:47:35.490 I lost the words but this expectation that your site overall is accessible so 01:47:35.490 --> 01:47:39.720 if I end up on these pages and those pages are pretty well done as far as an 01:47:39.720 --> 01:47:44.520 accessibility perspective I feel pretty good that the rest of your site is 01:47:44.520 --> 01:47:49.170 accessible if those pages are terrible but the rest of your site is really 01:47:49.170 --> 01:47:53.700 accessible my first impression is is like this whole site stinks and so I'm 01:47:53.700 --> 01:47:57.600 going to be looking for issues from that point on you know so you kind of set the 01:47:57.600 --> 01:48:03.330 expectation on those pages you also want to look at your page templates because 01:48:03.330 --> 01:48:06.870 most most sites are going to use some kind of content management system and 01:48:06.870 --> 01:48:10.980 we're going to build that content on a framework of templates so you want to 01:48:10.980 --> 01:48:16.010 make sure that template is accessible at the base meaning your global navigation 01:48:16.010 --> 01:48:20.910 any images your use that's appearing on all these pages that all that stuff is 01:48:20.910 --> 01:48:25.140 accessible because that cascades down through your site so even if you have 01:48:25.140 --> 01:48:29.430 issues now and you identify those and then you address them you're gonna get a 01:48:29.430 --> 01:48:33.360 nice boost to the overall accessibility of your site because they will cascade 01:48:33.360 --> 01:48:37.050 down to all the pages that are using them and then from that point forward 01:48:37.050 --> 01:48:42.360 you can start looking at more of the unique content you also want identify 01:48:42.360 --> 01:48:46.860 critical user scenarios and what we mean by that is Sam coming into the campus 01:48:46.860 --> 01:48:53.100 site and maybe it requires me to create a user account to access some pages that 01:48:53.100 --> 01:48:58.050 I really need well am I able is that whole process of creating a user account 01:48:58.050 --> 01:49:01.920 and logging in is it accessible because that's not accessible you've totally 01:49:01.920 --> 01:49:05.700 blocked me from everything else so those are like key user scenarios that you 01:49:05.700 --> 01:49:10.590 want to identify not not every user scenario is a key for example maybe 01:49:10.590 --> 01:49:14.670 signing up for a newsletter is a secondary feature of the site yeah you 01:49:14.670 --> 01:49:17.520 want to make sure that's accessible but that's not the very first thing you 01:49:17.520 --> 01:49:21.480 probably have to look at so you can you can start ranking these different things 01:49:21.480 --> 01:49:26.670 these different tasks as the importance you know our users need this definitely 01:49:26.670 --> 01:49:30.480 they don't always need this so we'll look at that later and what you're doing 01:49:30.480 --> 01:49:34.080 now is you're taking a site that could be thousands of pages and now you're 01:49:34.080 --> 01:49:38.640 consolidating it down to something that's manageable so that way if you're 01:49:38.640 --> 01:49:43.250 using a scanning tool if you're doing manual testing they're all things that 01:49:43.250 --> 01:49:48.650 can do reasonably on that smaller subset that sampling of your site and what 01:49:48.650 --> 01:49:54.980 that's going to do for you it's also going to allow you to identify the most 01:49:54.980 --> 01:50:00.170 common type of issues so for example say you have a number of forms that the 01:50:00.170 --> 01:50:03.020 forms aren't labeled properly those input fields aren't labeled properly 01:50:03.020 --> 01:50:06.590 well there's a good chance the rest of your site is like that as well and now 01:50:06.590 --> 01:50:11.150 you can say okay we need to go out after we've established this go out and find 01:50:11.150 --> 01:50:15.110 these pages let's fix these first let's go and teach our our content creators 01:50:15.110 --> 01:50:19.450 how to properly label these fields you know so that we don't keep introducing 01:50:19.450 --> 01:50:22.970 inaccessible content so there's a lot you can gain from that on just that 01:50:22.970 --> 01:50:28.790 small sampling and of course you have to do manual testing in addition to 01:50:28.790 --> 01:50:32.360 scanning scanning solutions are great for finding a lot of easy issues such as 01:50:32.360 --> 01:50:36.740 alt text missing from images and things like that but again they don't find the 01:50:36.740 --> 01:50:41.510 majority of real blocking issues we talked about keyboard accessibility and 01:50:41.510 --> 01:50:46.250 showed an example of that again keyboard testing is something everybody can do 01:50:46.250 --> 01:50:50.060 and because you're testing on a smaller sampling of your site now and then 01:50:50.060 --> 01:50:53.990 generally when we break it down that way we're looking at a site that could be 01:50:53.990 --> 01:50:58.880 thousands of pages when we actually narrow it down it averages anywhere from 01:50:58.880 --> 01:51:03.290 20 to 30 pages that we really have to test to get a feel for how accessible 01:51:03.290 --> 01:51:06.320 our site is and to really start identifying the things we need to 01:51:06.320 --> 01:51:11.510 address okay that's really taking a huge chunk of data and making it something 01:51:11.510 --> 01:51:15.320 that you can actually accomplish and that's something that most people are 01:51:15.320 --> 01:51:19.490 never made aware of when they're trying to start out so keyboard testing is key 01:51:19.490 --> 01:51:23.990 anybody can do keyboard testing the thing to remember with keyboard testing 01:51:23.990 --> 01:51:27.380 is making sure that you're always able to track visually where your input 01:51:27.380 --> 01:51:32.570 focuses with the keyboard and that when you get to a control that's interactive 01:51:32.570 --> 01:51:36.830 like say maybe you're going to select a date and you get a little calendar pop 01:51:36.830 --> 01:51:41.810 up are you able to fully do that with the keyboard or do you have to finally 01:51:41.810 --> 01:51:46.040 resort to using your mouse if you have to use your mouse at any time that's a 01:51:46.040 --> 01:51:49.640 problem right that's a blocker that needs to be addressed and again keyboard 01:51:49.640 --> 01:51:54.050 accessibility is so important that a lot of assistive technologies use that as a 01:51:54.050 --> 01:51:57.020 baseline to build upon so if that's not working you're going 01:51:57.020 --> 01:52:01.070 to basically be introducing a lot of other issues later on and that's it's 01:52:01.070 --> 01:52:04.820 the easiest and cheapest type of testing you can do and like I said anybody can 01:52:04.820 --> 01:52:08.240 do it if they know what they're looking for a screen reader testing we don't 01:52:08.240 --> 01:52:11.720 always recommend that people just pick up a screen reader and do that because 01:52:11.720 --> 01:52:16.430 used to be jaws was the one jaws will cost you a thousand bucks just to get a 01:52:16.430 --> 01:52:21.050 copy of um the other thing jaws does it's not a testing tool it's actually 01:52:21.050 --> 01:52:25.190 designed to help people read the content so it'll do a lot of auto correcting for 01:52:25.190 --> 01:52:30.080 poorly coded pages so if you're going to do that we recommend you use probably 01:52:30.080 --> 01:52:35.330 the open source one NVDA have you've not seen that it's it's you can download it 01:52:35.330 --> 01:52:40.220 for free and you can download little instructions on how to navigate a web 01:52:40.220 --> 01:52:43.490 and all that kind of thing and then you would use that you can use that to get 01:52:43.490 --> 01:52:47.690 familiar but it's also again that's something that takes time to get 01:52:47.690 --> 01:52:51.380 familiar with and start using properly because you have to put yourself into 01:52:51.380 --> 01:52:57.980 the mindset of that blind user and so if I come to a say a navigation of 01:52:57.980 --> 01:53:03.620 navigation controls one of the things you that you may miss if you haven't 01:53:03.620 --> 01:53:07.040 been doing for doing it for any length of time or thinking about what that user 01:53:07.040 --> 01:53:10.820 experiences is you probably want to make sure that those links are marked up in 01:53:10.820 --> 01:53:14.240 the list even though they may not be displayed as a list the reason is is 01:53:14.240 --> 01:53:18.140 because now as the user I'm told how many options I have in that menu are 01:53:18.140 --> 01:53:21.740 that navigation gives me the ability to jump past it without having to read 01:53:21.740 --> 01:53:25.520 every single one of those so there's a lot of little things like that that you 01:53:25.520 --> 01:53:29.600 can learn over time but if you're in a hurry you might want to you know partner 01:53:29.600 --> 01:53:34.160 with somebody like like 6:00 terror you know or anybody else that provides that 01:53:34.160 --> 01:53:37.730 kind of service to do that kind of screen reader testing and again that's 01:53:37.730 --> 01:53:41.990 why it's important that you consolidate your sites down into a smaller subset 01:53:41.990 --> 01:53:45.710 because then it's going to cost you a lot less money if you do have to engage 01:53:45.710 --> 01:53:51.350 with a third party consultant to do that kind of work screen magnifier that's 01:53:51.350 --> 01:53:54.710 usually pretty a pretty easy test ultimately what you're looking for with 01:53:54.710 --> 01:53:59.480 a screen magnification testing it's kind of incorporated with the the keyboard 01:53:59.480 --> 01:54:04.490 testing you want to make sure that not only can i zoom in up to 200% and still 01:54:04.490 --> 01:54:08.330 be able to read everything without it being too pixelated most likely that's 01:54:08.330 --> 01:54:10.400 going to be like if you have images of texts that are 01:54:10.400 --> 01:54:15.110 resolution and that the information in that text is critical it is too 01:54:15.110 --> 01:54:18.800 pixelated I can't read it up to 200 percent the other thing you want to look 01:54:18.800 --> 01:54:21.860 for with screen magnification is as you're tabbing around you want to make 01:54:21.860 --> 01:54:25.970 sure that it's tracking your focus so if I tab from here over to a link on this 01:54:25.970 --> 01:54:29.720 side of the page that screen magnifier should trigger an update in the view if 01:54:29.720 --> 01:54:33.920 it doesn't that's an accessibility issue for magnification but screen 01:54:33.920 --> 01:54:38.120 magnification is usually a pretty quick test you have to do too much with that a 01:54:38.120 --> 01:54:43.460 voice command software again that's the like Dragon NaturallySpeaking that you'd 01:54:43.460 --> 01:54:46.820 usually not have to do too much testing with that but it's always good to do so 01:54:46.820 --> 01:54:52.070 because often what the voice command software will be relying on is to make 01:54:52.070 --> 01:54:57.140 sure that input controls and links and things like that are if they're coded 01:54:57.140 --> 01:55:02.120 properly I can give the command to move my mouse the first name or whatever and 01:55:02.120 --> 01:55:05.510 it will move the focus over there but if it's not coded properly it's not going 01:55:05.510 --> 01:55:09.440 to know where that is so again that's not too hard of a test but it there's a 01:55:09.440 --> 01:55:14.750 little bit of a learning curve with that one something you could definitely do so 01:55:14.750 --> 01:55:18.290 that's kind of the manual testing so we talked about different passes you know 01:55:18.290 --> 01:55:21.530 if you've ever been in the QA world oftentimes you go through and you'll 01:55:21.530 --> 01:55:24.140 test something once right I'll go through in a mouse and I'll test her it 01:55:24.140 --> 01:55:27.290 looks like it's working great when it comes to accessibility you have to do 01:55:27.290 --> 01:55:30.320 multiple passes because there's different aspects as we just went 01:55:30.320 --> 01:55:33.380 through that you have to take into account you can't do it all at once 01:55:33.380 --> 01:55:39.380 so plan for that now the benefits of manual testing keyboard only you got 01:55:39.380 --> 01:55:44.030 your assistive technology contrast in cognitive we didn't talk about those so 01:55:44.030 --> 01:55:48.560 ultimately keyboard testing is probably the most important then your assistive 01:55:48.560 --> 01:55:52.700 technology comes into play a lot of your scanning solutions will find contrast 01:55:52.700 --> 01:55:56.420 issues but it's also going to find a lot of false positives with your contrast 01:55:56.420 --> 01:56:01.280 issues in most cases cognitive is very difficult to scan for so when we list 01:56:01.280 --> 01:56:05.180 these four different things what we're really looking to do is kind of 01:56:05.180 --> 01:56:12.890 incorporate the full user experience so what we recommend is is when it comes to 01:56:12.890 --> 01:56:17.000 these manual testing passes is you put a lot of effort into your keyboard testing 01:56:17.000 --> 01:56:21.110 put some effort into your screen reader testing and your assistive technology 01:56:21.110 --> 01:56:24.250 testing but when a cousin comes to the contrast and the cognitive part 01:56:24.250 --> 01:56:29.800 that if you start to become familiar with what it means for a color 01:56:29.800 --> 01:56:34.530 combination to be out of that contrast range which in most cases is 4.5 to 1 01:56:34.530 --> 01:56:38.680 you're you can start to identify that you know something that's really bad you 01:56:38.680 --> 01:56:41.770 can identify that just by looking at it right so as you're going through your 01:56:41.770 --> 01:56:45.730 keyboard only testing in your assistive technology testing you want to be alert 01:56:45.730 --> 01:56:50.050 to that if you if you see an area that you question make a note of it then 01:56:50.050 --> 01:56:53.620 after you're done with the keyboard and any assistive technology testing go back 01:56:53.620 --> 01:56:57.070 and use something like the color contrast analyzer it's a free tool you 01:56:57.070 --> 01:57:02.320 can download it's Co L oh you are it's the British spelling analyzer and that 01:57:02.320 --> 01:57:06.130 way you can kind of go in there and test it really quick that way you're kind of 01:57:06.130 --> 01:57:09.310 double-checking that scanning solution you might be using as well because that 01:57:09.310 --> 01:57:13.570 may have missed it when it comes to the cognitive obviously you're not going to 01:57:13.570 --> 01:57:16.810 catch everything with that but what we're looking for again as we're doing 01:57:16.810 --> 01:57:21.220 our primary testing on that page we're looking for the use of color as the only 01:57:21.220 --> 01:57:26.770 way to convey information for example if you're looking at an online store and 01:57:26.770 --> 01:57:31.230 something's out of stock but the price is put in red because it's out of stock 01:57:31.230 --> 01:57:34.900 well how am I going to know that unless there's some kind of text equivalent 01:57:34.900 --> 01:57:39.700 right so the color is one of the things you're looking for as far as conveying 01:57:39.700 --> 01:57:43.180 information there should be always a textual way of conveying that or at 01:57:43.180 --> 01:57:47.710 least some kind of pattern so that would fall into the cognitive field another 01:57:47.710 --> 01:57:55.450 thing you can look at is for unnecessary use of big words you are maybe 01:57:55.450 --> 01:58:00.460 referencing certain locations on the page we did a test once for the haircare 01:58:00.460 --> 01:58:05.440 product site and on that webpage you went to it and the does the haircare 01:58:05.440 --> 01:58:10.420 designer or whatever you called them had a big paragraph at the top that kind of 01:58:10.420 --> 01:58:13.810 talked about his passion and all that kind of stuff and he says if you want a 01:58:13.810 --> 01:58:17.920 custom experience go look on the left side of the page if you want something a 01:58:17.920 --> 01:58:21.220 little bit more generic look on the right side of the page well as a blind 01:58:21.220 --> 01:58:24.730 user you would never know which ones left and right so the better way to 01:58:24.730 --> 01:58:29.620 accomplish that was maybe to provide header tags that say hey look under look 01:58:29.620 --> 01:58:33.130 for this heading you know you know custom experience look for this one you 01:58:33.130 --> 01:58:36.160 know just general experience that type of thing the other problem with that 01:58:36.160 --> 01:58:40.000 site is when you squished it down to a smaller form factor those two 01:58:40.000 --> 01:58:44.050 sections that were on the left and the right now we're on top of top and bottom 01:58:44.050 --> 01:58:47.739 of each other so it made no sense anyways so those are the kind of things 01:58:47.739 --> 01:58:51.670 we can look for as we go through just these little additional things that we 01:58:51.670 --> 01:58:55.120 can capture when we're doing our manual testing again this is something that 01:58:55.120 --> 01:59:06.010 most people can learn to do fairly easy yes you can insert into your pages that 01:59:06.010 --> 01:59:10.570 basically tells the screen reader to read that tag first like you know like 01:59:10.570 --> 01:59:17.500 if you have for example like an audio file like trying to it would say you 01:59:17.500 --> 01:59:24.070 know like if you're interested in like you know that a good question yeah so 01:59:24.070 --> 01:59:27.400 there is what we call Aria I don't know if you're familiar with that and what 01:59:27.400 --> 01:59:33.370 aria is it's a it's basically a way of tagging content with that particular 01:59:33.370 --> 01:59:37.630 idea in mind as is the HTML doesn't give us enough to actually make this work 01:59:37.630 --> 01:59:41.890 exactly the way we want so we can incorporate some of these Aria tags to 01:59:41.890 --> 01:59:45.460 kind of force the issue one thing you don't want to do is just rely on Aria 01:59:45.460 --> 01:59:49.780 alone because now you're you're not thinking about the keyboard users and 01:59:49.780 --> 01:59:52.780 all these other people right but that's one way you could do like use aria 01:59:52.780 --> 01:59:57.130 described by or something like that the other way you could do it too is when 01:59:57.130 --> 02:00:00.550 you if you're designing the page from scratch to make sure that that content 02:00:00.550 --> 02:00:08.590 is encountered first just like with the required fields in a form control raar 02:00:08.590 --> 02:00:15.820 IA i forget exactly what it stands for accessible interface testable rich 02:00:15.820 --> 02:00:25.030 Internet application yeah and then the other thing when it comes to this manual 02:00:25.030 --> 02:00:28.270 testing and you might notice that you're going to hear a lot about scanning 02:00:28.270 --> 02:00:32.230 solutions is the way to go but we're here to tell you scanning solutions have 02:00:32.230 --> 02:00:36.400 their place but when you're starting out and you're trying to determine how 02:00:36.400 --> 02:00:40.630 accessible are we what issues do we have that we need to fix you know what kind 02:00:40.630 --> 02:00:44.050 of training you have to understand that you're not going to likely get that from 02:00:44.050 --> 02:00:47.590 a scanning solution right off the bat but we do recommend using a scanning 02:00:47.590 --> 02:00:51.429 solution but especially doing this manual testing at first 02:00:51.429 --> 02:00:55.059 in this way because it's going to give you a lot of information that you 02:00:55.059 --> 02:00:58.630 wouldn't get otherwise and really help you understand things well in one of the 02:00:58.630 --> 02:01:02.139 important things we can get once we have this gone through this and start to 02:01:02.139 --> 02:01:06.849 understand things we can give this feedback back into our design teams if 02:01:06.849 --> 02:01:10.959 we have a design team that says hey you know when we create a table we need to 02:01:10.959 --> 02:01:14.829 make sure we're creating tables in this way to make them accessible or when 02:01:14.829 --> 02:01:18.550 we're creating a form make sure you're using the label for tag as opposed to 02:01:18.550 --> 02:01:22.539 just a label tag or no label tag at all you know that type of thing those little 02:01:22.539 --> 02:01:26.619 things can go a long way and into incorporating or creating a culture of 02:01:26.619 --> 02:01:30.849 accessibility when it comes to creating content and that's really key to whether 02:01:30.849 --> 02:01:33.999 or not you're going to be successful moving forward and whether or not you're 02:01:33.999 --> 02:01:38.229 going to be able to maintain some type of accessible content so I think we're 02:01:38.229 --> 02:01:42.579 kind of running out of time so we're not going to get into the automated testing 02:01:42.579 --> 02:01:46.329 part of it but if you'd like to know more about what you should be looking 02:01:46.329 --> 02:01:50.320 for in an automated solution and things to consider we'll be happy to talk to 02:01:50.320 --> 02:01:55.360 you about that they're all different they're all beneficial in some way but 02:01:55.360 --> 02:01:59.409 they're all very different so really kind of comes down to what am I going to 02:01:59.409 --> 02:02:03.789 need today and next week because you don't want to beat our next year ten 02:02:03.789 --> 02:02:06.969 years from now because you don't want to build a process around a tool then have 02:02:06.969 --> 02:03:01.959 to go and change out that tool later and that's painful do we have any other yeah 02:03:01.959 --> 02:03:07.340 that's actually a really good question we happens to be a challenge for most 02:03:07.340 --> 02:03:12.080 organizations when they start down there's a lot of resistance at first so 02:03:12.080 --> 02:03:16.580 one of the organizations we work with Cal State Universities took a different 02:03:16.580 --> 02:03:21.800 approach they were having difficulty getting buy-in fortunately for them what 02:03:21.800 --> 02:03:24.650 happened is they were using a scanning well they were using our scanning 02:03:24.650 --> 02:03:28.820 solution but there's something came up internally across those campuses that 02:03:28.820 --> 02:03:33.520 had to go around broken links and it became this big political issue and 02:03:33.520 --> 02:03:37.610 fortunately for us our tool actually searched for broken links so they 02:03:37.610 --> 02:03:42.710 started using our tool to do that and then as they did that people became 02:03:42.710 --> 02:03:46.190 familiar with our tool and comfortable with it that then they started 02:03:46.190 --> 02:03:51.050 introducing accessibility aspects of it one at a time not as they didn't take 02:03:51.050 --> 02:03:55.610 all the guidelines and say here you go they started introducing like well let's 02:03:55.610 --> 02:04:02.360 scan for the missing alt text on images next less scan for form control issues 02:04:02.360 --> 02:04:06.140 then as people got used to interacting and using that tool they were able to 02:04:06.140 --> 02:04:11.900 start adding more and more in addition to that there was some some of the 02:04:11.900 --> 02:04:15.110 techniques that were being used that they felt really didn't they didn't like 02:04:15.110 --> 02:04:20.000 though they were able to customize those or take them out entirely that was one 02:04:20.000 --> 02:04:24.380 that was one approach but the other thing was is because they realized that 02:04:24.380 --> 02:04:27.170 you can't just throw this at people because most people have their 02:04:27.170 --> 02:04:30.680 day-to-day jobs and when you throw them say hey you can have to do accessibility 02:04:30.680 --> 02:04:34.220 as well accessibility when you're starting out can be very difficult to 02:04:34.220 --> 02:04:38.660 understand and grasp what they did is they created what they called their web 02:04:38.660 --> 02:04:43.250 community and so every every week or every month they would have certain 02:04:43.250 --> 02:04:46.430 people that represented each campus or different departments and they would get 02:04:46.430 --> 02:04:50.030 together and they were discussed the different challenges they were having 02:04:50.030 --> 02:04:53.300 the different things they were doing towards accessibility or maybe they had 02:04:53.300 --> 02:04:56.090 something that they didn't know what to do with they could throw that out as a 02:04:56.090 --> 02:04:59.930 topic and then they would talk about that together and kind of come up with a 02:04:59.930 --> 02:05:06.110 solution so it started to build some kind of mmm momentum behind this whole 02:05:06.110 --> 02:05:09.920 accessibility initiative and people started to get interested and what we've 02:05:09.920 --> 02:05:15.290 determined are being able to see is that when you get somebody and like say in 02:05:15.290 --> 02:05:19.250 the content creation department and they really get they 02:05:19.250 --> 02:05:22.900 they get it and they start to become passionate about it they start to 02:05:22.900 --> 02:05:27.260 evangelize that internally you know they start you know teaching others what they 02:05:27.260 --> 02:05:31.310 know and it's just and at that point it kind of becomes part of the culture so 02:05:31.310 --> 02:05:35.690 you have to provide a means for people to be able to communicate if you leave 02:05:35.690 --> 02:05:40.040 them out their siloed and just say you have to go do this I'm likely nothing's 02:05:40.040 --> 02:05:44.960 going to happen you know and if anything does it's probably gonna you know alter 02:05:44.960 --> 02:05:48.050 at some point so you have to have something that will support them they 02:05:48.050 --> 02:05:51.950 also do regular trainings so recently they went from just using a scanning 02:05:51.950 --> 02:05:57.170 solution to trying to teach all their people how do we go about trip manually 02:05:57.170 --> 02:06:00.650 testing the things that a scanning solution doesn't find and so they 02:06:00.650 --> 02:06:04.820 started holding sessions to talk about how do you do keyboard testing how do 02:06:04.820 --> 02:06:08.000 you look for contrast issues things like that that's written and that's really 02:06:08.000 --> 02:06:21.910 been successful for them yeah so what my organization this is a few web products 02:06:21.910 --> 02:06:27.620 for the public it's a public university service kind of thing but what what 02:06:27.620 --> 02:06:35.780 those are are complex speak up a little bit complex data visualizations mm-hmm 02:06:35.780 --> 02:06:39.260 basically we're the web presentation is really quite complex it's economic data 02:06:39.260 --> 02:06:43.910 you can get tabular view or you can get chart views and the charts have controls 02:06:43.910 --> 02:06:48.140 and they have multiple axes so I'm gonna guess see you're not gonna tell me that 02:06:48.140 --> 02:06:51.950 because it's so complex that means you shouldn't have to worry you don't really 02:06:51.950 --> 02:06:55.810 have to worry about accessibility I guess we do have to worry to some extent 02:06:55.810 --> 02:07:00.020 it's out there for the public but I don't think there are too many general 02:07:00.020 --> 02:07:03.890 members of the public who are using it it's mostly academics and journalists 02:07:03.890 --> 02:07:09.320 and bureaucrats and people like that who are looking at it I guess but another 02:07:09.320 --> 02:07:14.330 thing about organization is it's an extremely small tech team I'm I'm the 02:07:14.330 --> 02:07:18.020 only full-time developer and we have a part-time developer and that's it and 02:07:18.020 --> 02:07:24.440 the rest is eco economists and no it seems sort of scary we're also hosting 02:07:24.440 --> 02:07:27.770 data portals for other organizations like we host a data portal for the 02:07:27.770 --> 02:07:32.570 county of Hawaii and I don't know whether we have any lead 02:07:32.570 --> 02:07:36.650 exposure if someone decides to sue county of Hawaii because of our they 02:07:36.650 --> 02:07:41.380 reportedly were providing for them and any kind any comments are appreciated 02:07:41.380 --> 02:07:47.330 yeah so I'll go first I'll let can fill in but when it comes to some of the 02:07:47.330 --> 02:07:51.080 complex more complex things like you said it's probably more of a limited 02:07:51.080 --> 02:07:55.280 audience just because it's inaccessible now as long as you're providing the 02:07:55.280 --> 02:07:58.970 means for somebody to get that information whether it's even calling a 02:07:58.970 --> 02:08:02.660 number and to be able to have that information provide it to them if you 02:08:02.660 --> 02:08:08.390 provide it that kind of access so that is something you can take as we can do 02:08:08.390 --> 02:08:12.920 this because we don't have the time or the money to do this and our target 02:08:12.920 --> 02:08:17.360 audience doesn't really it doesn't make sense right it's not reasonable but as 02:08:17.360 --> 02:08:21.430 far as the legal part of it that that 02:08:21.580 --> 02:08:26.030 yeah I'll add to that so one of the first presentations I used I gave when I 02:08:26.030 --> 02:08:31.220 was back at justice was to god it wasn't a Bureau of Labor Statistics but it was 02:08:31.220 --> 02:08:36.770 somebody like that and they they pulled it was a interagency group that hold 02:08:36.770 --> 02:08:40.790 together all these various statistical organizations within the different 02:08:40.790 --> 02:08:45.590 agency so yeah I remember justice management division was there for DOJ 02:08:45.590 --> 02:08:50.690 and you know well anyway so they had a there all these agencies have this 02:08:50.690 --> 02:08:56.480 amazing amount of tabular data and they were all on asking about well what are 02:08:56.480 --> 02:08:59.690 our obligations for making that accessible and the short answer is you 02:08:59.690 --> 02:09:04.310 got to make it accessible but I think that one of the strategies is that's 02:09:04.310 --> 02:09:09.380 useful that that that we ultimately compromised on was if you have data 02:09:09.380 --> 02:09:14.870 that's being visualized try to also provide it in a tabular format and then 02:09:14.870 --> 02:09:18.680 just make sure that table is accessible and making a table accessible it's 02:09:18.680 --> 02:09:26.210 relatively easy as to and a primary focus there should be on you know baking 02:09:26.210 --> 02:09:29.690 is just making sure there's a fairly simple table structure when you start 02:09:29.690 --> 02:09:33.830 talking about things like complex table structures where you're not able to get 02:09:33.830 --> 02:09:38.540 the right you're not using things you do things like instead of using a cost ban 02:09:38.540 --> 02:09:44.979 you have you know a reference to sell in order to understand to sell your rough 02:09:44.979 --> 02:09:49.329 in order to understand a cable you're referenced in a cell that's not directly 02:09:49.329 --> 02:09:54.729 above all of those columns because it's not using a call span in that case the 02:09:54.729 --> 02:09:59.199 screener is not going to pick up that what I call a diagonal lookup cell right 02:09:59.199 --> 02:10:03.429 it there's nothing unless you dude headers an ID but if you but if you use 02:10:03.429 --> 02:10:07.690 headers and IDs as attributes then you have to tag every single cell in the 02:10:07.690 --> 02:10:13.150 table properly and reference the right header cell but if you use if you break 02:10:13.150 --> 02:10:18.550 it down to a very simple two-dimensional table then you can get by with just 02:10:18.550 --> 02:10:26.289 using headers no I'm sorry table header cells th tags and table data cells and 02:10:26.289 --> 02:10:32.440 then it's it more or less looks things up properly using properest technology I 02:10:32.440 --> 02:10:39.280 mean ideally you want to be using dope equals call and scope equals row right 02:10:39.280 --> 02:10:44.739 Jeff Thanks yeah but you know that's more of a best-case and that just 02:10:44.739 --> 02:10:50.949 involves individually tagging each other right headers so you're still just 02:10:50.949 --> 02:10:54.820 adding a little bit of extra code to each of the cells at the top of the 02:10:54.820 --> 02:10:59.499 columns and the first cell on the rows were to indicate which ones are the 02:10:59.499 --> 02:11:06.969 relevant row headers what they call rows stubs and if you do that and it's 02:11:06.969 --> 02:11:22.059 relatively easy to code and it it makes it way more accessible so yeah you're 02:11:22.059 --> 02:11:25.059 likely using some kind of third-party library for those charts and everything 02:11:25.059 --> 02:11:34.690 right I would think with providing raw data in CSV help towards accessibility 02:11:34.690 --> 02:11:42.190 in that type in that case so we do we do have CSV download yeah that could 02:11:42.190 --> 02:11:45.909 definitely help me improving the accessibility of finding where the CSV 02:11:45.909 --> 02:11:49.030 download button is is good I don't think we're doing it I'm most a little bit 02:11:49.030 --> 02:11:51.789 handicapped because I'm not the front-end developer on the backend man 02:11:51.789 --> 02:11:57.760 having our front end person one thing to mention before everybody leaves is that 02:11:57.760 --> 02:12:01.219 when you do when you do start this process and you 02:12:01.219 --> 02:12:06.079 start to understand how how everything works it's always good to break it down 02:12:06.079 --> 02:12:10.429 in the sense like say I have a design team I have a team that's providing 02:12:10.429 --> 02:12:16.610 images a team that's writing the copy if you have that type of situation it's 02:12:16.610 --> 02:12:20.449 always good to start to develop checklist in-and-out checklist so that 02:12:20.449 --> 02:12:24.860 hey when I receive this copy from somebody I know that it should have this 02:12:24.860 --> 02:12:28.190 information if I received this image from somebody I know it should have 02:12:28.190 --> 02:12:32.270 what alt text goes there so as the developer I'm told to put an image on 02:12:32.270 --> 02:12:36.349 the page I should also be told what the alt text should be I shouldn't be left 02:12:36.349 --> 02:12:39.739 up to me to make that decision though but that says you start getting into the 02:12:39.739 --> 02:12:43.969 more advanced process and that's that's something that Ken and I help with we've 02:12:43.969 --> 02:12:48.530 helped a number of larger corporations develop that kind of process as well and 02:12:48.530 --> 02:12:53.270 it's it's really important because now everybody has a responsibility to know 02:12:53.270 --> 02:12:59.659 what the responsibility is and it makes things flow so there's you've got quite 02:12:59.659 --> 02:13:03.380 the journey in front of you don't think you're going to do it overnight but if 02:13:03.380 --> 02:13:08.960 you take a structured approach and you a planned approach you'll be successful at 02:13:08.960 --> 02:13:16.190 it any other questions this may be too general the question is 02:13:16.190 --> 02:13:23.599 Sonny at Hilo there is in our VRA there is an undue burden clause but undue 02:13:23.599 --> 02:13:30.469 burden is a completely unknown and for us in the trenches is that too specific 02:13:30.469 --> 02:13:35.989 to our institution or is there some sort of generic thing standard for what is 02:13:35.989 --> 02:13:43.369 undue burden okay so actually the concept of undue burden was developed in 02:13:43.369 --> 02:13:50.000 504 and title 3 of the ADA a and there's a lot of guidance on a da-da-da website 02:13:50.000 --> 02:13:54.699 about what it means but it's always in the context of things like sign language 02:13:54.699 --> 02:13:59.210 interpreters and basically what it means is that you're looking at the overall 02:13:59.210 --> 02:14:05.449 financial resources of an organization and trying to and you have to look at 02:14:05.449 --> 02:14:09.889 the year-end financials it's not just on a case-by-case basis almost it almost 02:14:09.889 --> 02:14:15.950 never succeeds I once testified before Congress on a in 02:14:15.950 --> 02:14:19.460 support of the 21st century communications and video accessibility 02:14:19.460 --> 02:14:25.190 Act and I one of the things I was testifying about was exactly this life 02:14:25.190 --> 02:14:33.170 it's about undue burden what it means how the undue burden the the burdens 02:14:33.170 --> 02:14:37.820 always on the defendant by contrast and readily achievable the birds usually on 02:14:37.820 --> 02:14:41.510 the plaintiff to prove so it's it's a Sunday that the defendant has to prove 02:14:41.510 --> 02:14:47.600 and then this hurdle is so much higher that it's it really becomes almost 02:14:47.600 --> 02:14:52.310 impossible thing to meet sometimes in the count there are a few cases where 02:14:52.310 --> 02:14:56.720 it's succeeded like for instance where you know a 02:14:56.720 --> 02:15:00.800 doctor was really able to show that you know if they provided that sign language 02:15:00.800 --> 02:15:05.540 interpreter to a patient to you know one particular patient that they were going 02:15:05.540 --> 02:15:10.460 to go bankrupt it it's it's an incredibly high standard there are other 02:15:10.460 --> 02:15:15.230 defenses the things like fundamental alteration that might be more relevant 02:15:15.230 --> 02:15:19.190 so you know when you're talking about that language translation and Hawaiian 02:15:19.190 --> 02:15:22.730 for instance you know I was thinking to myself well what if you got a page 02:15:22.730 --> 02:15:27.620 that's written in Hawaiian and the part of the TAT it was part of the test you 02:15:27.620 --> 02:15:31.400 try to understand well what's the how does a person pronounce that you know 02:15:31.400 --> 02:15:35.720 are they are they capable ready capable of really reading it or it's we've 02:15:35.720 --> 02:15:40.250 studied it in that case you know then something like fundamental alteration 02:15:40.250 --> 02:15:45.110 might come in because if you did say create an audio file of that of that 02:15:45.110 --> 02:15:49.640 text then that defeats the whole purpose of you know trying to see whether the 02:15:49.640 --> 02:15:55.910 person could read it right so things like that there are there are other 02:15:55.910 --> 02:16:04.660 defense available but undue burdens are really really really hard okay thank you 02:16:11.299 --> 02:16:18.239 so you had the four-step model and I either I missed something or we flew 02:16:18.239 --> 02:16:23.189 through for the accessibility statement the manual testing the automated testing 02:16:23.189 --> 02:16:31.679 and did I miss something or do we let me go back to that yeah so I could just 02:16:31.679 --> 02:16:35.279 answer that it's what we call the creating the culture of accessibility 02:16:35.279 --> 02:16:39.569 and what that gets to is the checklist though we didn't have time to really 02:16:39.569 --> 02:16:54.929 talk about on that or maybe just related to that can we get your slides do you 02:16:54.929 --> 02:17:00.059 want them to contact you or they could just email us directly to yeah if you 02:17:00.059 --> 02:17:12.179 want slides go ahead an email I TSA DEA at Hawaii and request those this video 02:17:12.179 --> 02:17:15.840 is sorry this presentation is also being recorded I'm pretty sure we're gonna put 02:17:15.840 --> 02:17:22.109 it on Hawaii we're gonna put on the IES website somewhere and I'm not exactly 02:17:22.109 --> 02:17:27.840 sure yeah exactly thank you yeah two points that I wanted 02:17:27.840 --> 02:17:31.829 to mention that we didn't have time to cover in order to fit it into time 02:17:31.829 --> 02:17:36.929 restrictions but you know you guys seem as though you don't have an 11:30 stop 02:17:36.929 --> 02:17:44.039 so I just wanted to mention it that the part about the excited testing I think 02:17:44.039 --> 02:17:48.420 one of the key things there is that there are we noticed that there are four 02:17:48.420 --> 02:17:51.750 basic accessibility issues that keep popping up over and over and over again 02:17:51.750 --> 02:17:56.550 it happened to be audited very read very amenable to automated testing 02:17:56.550 --> 02:18:04.199 technologies and those so being able to segregate those out is pretty important 02:18:04.199 --> 02:18:09.569 because it's pretty clear to us that one that the plaintiffs are using those 02:18:09.569 --> 02:18:13.920 tools when they're using them they're using automated testing tools to to 02:18:13.920 --> 02:18:19.139 figure out who they're who they're going to go sue so because they're suing style 02:18:19.139 --> 02:18:23.460 of thousands of organizations and they can't they're not having blind 02:18:23.460 --> 02:18:27.160 plaintiffs go and visit every single one of them other 02:18:27.160 --> 02:18:32.320 prospective lawsuits prospective victims I should say before they go and Sue them 02:18:32.320 --> 02:18:35.320 they go and use an automated testing tool then they pick up the phone and 02:18:35.320 --> 02:18:39.219 call their blind first blind friend who then looks at the site and verifies that 02:18:39.219 --> 02:18:42.429 they can't access it so being able to segregate that out it's important so 02:18:42.429 --> 02:18:47.500 that that that benefit of using an automated testing tool is as and to my 02:18:47.500 --> 02:18:49.840 from my perspective too large could take you off 02:18:49.840 --> 02:18:53.889 take your pick you a little bit less soft but more off the radar to a 02:18:53.889 --> 02:18:59.519 potential plaintiff and then that culture of accessibility deals with the 02:18:59.519 --> 02:19:04.870 Ute a quick egg you break it down into into a checklist of specific 02:19:04.870 --> 02:19:10.690 requirements that are actionable by different stakeholders within your 02:19:10.690 --> 02:19:15.730 organization and you create just as just a set of checklists and then you figure 02:19:15.730 --> 02:19:20.200 out you get everybody in her room and then you ask them okay so who's gonna 02:19:20.200 --> 02:19:24.370 take care of each requirement so who's gonna write the alternate text for the 02:19:24.370 --> 02:19:29.620 images when an image is created who's gonna worry about the color contrast and 02:19:29.620 --> 02:19:34.300 an image who's gonna be worried about that you know the text size and you know 02:19:34.300 --> 02:19:37.990 somebody's gonna have to take ownership of it and it's usually not going to be 02:19:37.990 --> 02:19:41.920 the developer it's gonna be like the people people that are write it that are 02:19:41.920 --> 02:19:45.460 creating the graphics people that are writing to copy things like that it 02:19:45.460 --> 02:19:48.219 might be at a content creators if you're putting it into a content management 02:19:48.219 --> 02:19:52.090 system what are those discernible tasks and 02:19:52.090 --> 02:19:56.140 then creating a set an input checklist and output checklists you know the 02:19:56.140 --> 02:19:59.860 output checklist is what do we have to do in order to accomplish this before we 02:19:59.860 --> 02:20:03.700 hand it to the next guy and the input checklist is what do we leave what are 02:20:03.700 --> 02:20:09.790 we looking for to be provided to us when we're getting handed a project so if we 02:20:09.790 --> 02:20:13.720 don't get it then we kick it back to the person who had that responsibility and 02:20:13.720 --> 02:20:19.000 so it creates obligations and accountability on on everybody and it 02:20:19.000 --> 02:20:23.500 really does do this amazing job of creating this self-sustaining culture of 02:20:23.500 --> 02:20:27.070 accessibility because now everybody's involved in it as opposed to just 02:20:27.070 --> 02:20:32.830 throwing it over the fence and hoping that the developers somehow fix it I can 02:20:32.830 --> 02:20:36.940 mention the white paper about four key issues that attract web accessibility 02:20:36.940 --> 02:20:40.439 litigation I tried to type in the web address on this 02:20:40.439 --> 02:20:45.789 thing but kin uses the Dvorak keyboard so I couldn't get it so but if you go to 02:20:45.789 --> 02:20:50.619 compliance sheriff comm you'll go to the section says resources you'll be able to 02:20:50.619 --> 02:20:53.470 access that white paper there and that'll tell you those four items that 02:20:53.470 --> 02:21:08.649 you that those top-level items that really attract litigation thank you all 02:21:08.649 --> 02:21:12.420 for attending thank you